Red diesel.....

[Vinpetrol]

What are the issues for any guys running older plant (I mean me and Rory )using white diesel or hvo fuel in regards to the additives .
Will our older non common rail engines cope better or worse than the newer Diesel engines in newer plant with bio etc

 

[V8Druid]

What are the issues for any guys running older plant (I mean me and Rory )using white diesel or hvo fuel in regards to the additives .
Will our older non common rail engines cope better or worse than the newer Diesel engines in newer plant with bio etc

bugger the plant @Vinpetrol ........... think of yer wallet ..... them 13 tonners o' yours'll fair drink it in a day

 

[Vinpetrol]

bugger the plant @Vinpetrol ........... think of yer wallet ..... them 13 tonners o' yours'll fair drink it in a day

It won’t matter , All the farmers new 13 tonners will be doing all my jobs on red diesel for half the price I will be able to .

 

[V8Druid]

It won’t matter , All the farmers new 13 tonners will be doing all my jobs on red diesel for half the price I will be able to .

and therein lies yet another problem .... the playing field will be even more uphill from there on in

 

[V8Druid]

someone asked the other night about what colour it'd be ...... just found the stuff James has been using .. Shell GTL gas to liquid ..

looks very interesting

if James is paying 63-64p/L, it's on a par with today's red price ... wonder how long that'll last?

Shell GTL Fuel | Shell Global

Learn about a cleaner-burning synthetic diesel alternative from Shell Commercial Fuels to help reduce local emissions. Visit our site to find out more.

www.shell.com

Will fill Matt, at me oil place, in on this tomorrow and see what he has to say ? Might be cancelling the red order and banging this stuff in -- if i can source it?

 

[JD450A]

It won’t matter , All the farmers new 13 tonners will be doing all my jobs on red diesel for half the price I will be able to .

Unfortunately this is the bottom line.

R.e HVO my understanding is it acts like a aggressive cleaner and will strip all the crap out of the fuel system. Hence the recommendation to change fuel filters first few weeks of using it. It's touted as a plus by suppliers but knowing what I know cleaning the crap out of the fuel pump in particular is not a big plus in many cases

GTL sounds a much nicer fuel all round.

Trouble is both are to be charged out at white tax rate come April for us.

I'm already planning to send out two price lists..... Agri/forestry and Construction...... But hard times are coming..... Think many will have to run bent or die trying

 

[fred]

read somewhere a while ago that new builds could not get a gas connection as the network can't support any more demand and has been the case for a while .. could you confirm or deny that Matt ?

tha's a lorra Kw out of that

no problem getting a new gas connection even after the new build ban. You just wont get a completion cert as it doesn't meet regs.

 

[fred]

45 and 50kw combis imo are one highly inefficient way of making hot water, if there's space available an unvented cylinder surely must be far cheaper to run long term. I bet a lot fitted are restricted by the gas supply, I've seen a lot of combis with inadequate gas pipework as is.

problem with combi's is flow rate. You cant run 2 showers at the same time off a combi with any sort of decent flow.

So you have to move to a tanked solution, this is where heat pumps start to compete as they use a tanked solution as well. In fairness they can heat up a tank pretty rapidly, 30 mins or faster. Ground source much better than air source.

They just dont work in older houses that are not airtight and have modern levels of insulation as they cant keep up.

 

[fred]

gas boilers till 2040 ,so no rush yet

2025 mate.

 

[fred]

The way I've always looked at it is if you can heat a 200 litre unvented cylinder in for arguments sake 30 mins with a likely heat output from boiler when you factor in pipework etc of probably 20kw, how long would the 45/50kw combi take to produce that amount of water (and not at 45deg temp rise which is how their figures work). Modern insulated cylinders have v minimal heat loss during a day if unused so i don't see storing water as the big loser it once was. Just seems to me putting even more kw into diverter valves heat exchangers etc is minimal extra for quite a lot more in.

the way the chap who installs our heat pumps explained it to me is, cylinders or heat stores as they now call them can be topped up for free/cheap during the day via solar or heat pump when there is little demand and used when its expensive to produce heat on demand. We put 2-4 cylinders in the 5 beds now to make sure they dont run out.

 

[GazCro]

the way the chap who installs our heat pumps explained it to me is, cylinders or heat stores as they now call them can be topped up for free/cheap during the day via solar or heat pump when there is little demand and used when its expensive to produce heat on demand. We put 2-4 cylinders in the 5 beds now to make sure they dont run out.

Trouble with heat pumps is they only achieve about 45deg water temp. Beyond that is reliant on immersion heaters and as you rarely find a hot water system set up to totally run out of hot water in reality you're basically just using immersion heaters for water all the time. They don't tell you this and those installing them certainly don't but any switched on end users soon find out the true cost of running them.

 

[Lancs Lad]

Trouble with heat pumps is they only achieve about 45deg water temp. Beyond that is reliant on immersion heaters and as you rarely find a hot water system set up to totally run out of hot water in reality you're basically just using immersion heaters for water all the time. They don't tell you this and those installing them certainly don't but any switched on end users soon find out the true cost of running them.

Been over this before...I've got 30 odd kw one plus 300odd litre tank and the big insulated header. Works ok now 3 years on . Costs wise it's prob a tad more than oil but no faff of getting it filled and the old trying to get best price etc. BUT you deffo need underfloor heating and decent insulation. But as I said before its RHI so paid off in 4 years time ...
It's all about getting a decent installer who knows his onions and the system plenty of horror stories out there but atm we happy.
I should add that no chance of us getting gas out here so it was either that or new oil blower and tank etc as was all buggered.

 

[V8Druid]

no problem getting a new gas connection even after the new build ban. You just wont get a completion cert as it doesn't meet regs.

what's "the new build ban" @fred

 

[JD450A]

Trouble with heat pumps is they only achieve about 45deg water temp.

Unless Rory does the installation of the pipes the two I've done have both caused issues with the field pipework working "too well"

 

[fred]

Trouble with heat pumps is they only achieve about 45deg water temp. Beyond that is reliant on immersion heaters and as you rarely find a hot water system set up to totally run out of hot water in reality you're basically just using immersion heaters for water all the time. They don't tell you this and those installing them certainly don't but any switched on end users soon find out the true cost of running them.

They get around this, it has a heat exchanger in the tank that gets it to 55c which is the max you can have for building regs (48c in jockland i believe)
. It still had to have an immersion to do the legionaiors cylcle once a month (or week i forget).

 

[Lancs Lad]

They get around this, it has a heat exchanger in the tank that gets it to 55c which is the max you can have for building regs (48c in jockland i believe)
. It still had to have an immersion to do the legionaiors cylcle once a month (or week i forget).

Sigactly

 

[fred]

what's "the new build ban" @fred

its the update to building regs to eliminate co2, 2025 no more gas as it wont meet regs. Also moving to 150 min cavity same time.

 

[V8Druid]

its the update to building regs to eliminate co2, 2025 no more gas as it wont meet regs. Also moving to 150 min cavity same time.

hutches'll get even smaller then .... footprint ain't gonna expand to accommodate it

 

[fred]

a lot of the measures are good really for the long term, getting subbies educated on changing the way stuff is done is a whole other ball game ....

 

[craig]

Unfortunately this is the bottom line.

R.e HVO my understanding is it acts like a aggressive cleaner and will strip all the crap out of the fuel system. Hence the recommendation to change fuel filters first few weeks of using it. It's touted as a plus by suppliers but knowing what I know cleaning the crap out of the fuel pump in particular is not a big plus in many cases

GTL sounds a much nicer fuel all round.

Trouble is both are to be charged out at white tax rate come April for us.

I'm already planning to send out two price lists..... Agri/forestry and Construction...... But hard times are coming..... Think many will have to run bent or die trying

The other thing reading about HVO, no sulphur, so no lube, older stuff wont like it, unless the manufactures add something else to it to give some lubrication