Electric vehicles

[V8Druid]

COP26 costly cult could lead to the overthrow of the elites

In the entire annals of human folly, it is difficult to find a contender to rival the charade called COP26.

bit.ly

throw this up there

don't know how many have read this but it is worth reading ......

".. And what is this all about? The earth has warmed by up to 1°C since the pre-industrial age. Certainly that is something to take into consideration, while trying, neutrally and calmly, to assess its possible consequences. If, as claimed, greenhouse gases are contributing to likely further warming, what is the composition of the greenhouse effect. Alarmists claim that Co2, both natural and man-made, is responsible for 72.3 per cent of the greenhouse effect. But that calculation excludes the largest component of the greenhouse effect, water vapour, accounting for around 95 per cent.

When the totality of greenhouse gases is assessed, Co2 accounts for only 3.6 per cent of the greenhouse effect, of which just 4 per cent is generated by human activity; alarmists claim that figure is 29 per cent. That is immaterial: eliminating 29 per cent of 3.6 per cent of the greenhouse effect would hardly have significant consequences. When water vapour is factored in (and why would it not be, when it is the largest part of the greenhouse effect?), if every nation on earth achieved Net Zero tomorrow, the result would be to eliminate between 0.14 per cent and 1.04 per cent of the greenhouse effect. Is that outcome worth beggaring the world and setting back human development?

Politically, this issue is hugely significant. The reality is that, even if there is a climate “emergency” (and the evidence does not suggest there is), there is no practical global response to avert it. As regards the significant, but not catastrophic, warming that is likely to occur, each nation must look to the protective ameliorations appropriate to its particular situation: in Britain, that means investing in widespread flood defences. Otherwise, some of the consequences might actually be benevolent. "

" the Prince of Wales announced in March, 2009 that the world had just 100 months to prevent irreversible climate disaster. That meant the jig should have been up by July, 2017. Yet last weekend HRH was now warning of “a dangerously narrow window of opportunity” to save the planet. "

" Other institutions have long lost any credibility. In 2007 the BBC predicted the Arctic would be ice-free by the summer of 2013: in the autumn of that year, the volume of Arctic ice increased by a third. "

some interesting figures and statements

 

[V8Druid]

Why is Insulate Britain being allowed to cause so much disruption?

The police have treated these eco-loons with kid gloves and the public has had enough of it.

www.spiked-online.com

throw this up there

very interesting read @Bob

 

[Lynchy]

very interesting read @Bob

Look who backs extinction/ insulate/Greta/ whatever fluffy slogans next?
Onedot and threefifty dot org,the mega rich WEF supporters,it's about system not climate change just another ,same as covid,crisis being put to good use

 

[craig]

don't know how many have read this but it is worth reading ......

".. And what is this all about? The earth has warmed by up to 1°C since the pre-industrial age. Certainly that is something to take into consideration, while trying, neutrally and calmly, to assess its possible consequences. If, as claimed, greenhouse gases are contributing to likely further warming, what is the composition of the greenhouse effect. Alarmists claim that Co2, both natural and man-made, is responsible for 72.3 per cent of the greenhouse effect. But that calculation excludes the largest component of the greenhouse effect, water vapour, accounting for around 95 per cent.

When the totality of greenhouse gases is assessed, Co2 accounts for only 3.6 per cent of the greenhouse effect, of which just 4 per cent is generated by human activity; alarmists claim that figure is 29 per cent. That is immaterial: eliminating 29 per cent of 3.6 per cent of the greenhouse effect would hardly have significant consequences. When water vapour is factored in (and why would it not be, when it is the largest part of the greenhouse effect?), if every nation on earth achieved Net Zero tomorrow, the result would be to eliminate between 0.14 per cent and 1.04 per cent of the greenhouse effect. Is that outcome worth beggaring the world and setting back human development?

Politically, this issue is hugely significant. The reality is that, even if there is a climate “emergency” (and the evidence does not suggest there is), there is no practical global response to avert it. As regards the significant, but not catastrophic, warming that is likely to occur, each nation must look to the protective ameliorations appropriate to its particular situation: in Britain, that means investing in widespread flood defences. Otherwise, some of the consequences might actually be benevolent. "

" the Prince of Wales announced in March, 2009 that the world had just 100 months to prevent irreversible climate disaster. That meant the jig should have been up by July, 2017. Yet last weekend HRH was now warning of “a dangerously narrow window of opportunity” to save the planet. "

" Other institutions have long lost any credibility. In 2007 the BBC predicted the Arctic would be ice-free by the summer of 2013: in the autumn of that year, the volume of Arctic ice increased by a third. "

some interesting figures and statements

All I know, is the worlds been warming up since the ice age

 

[Canal Navvy]

All I know, is the worlds been warming up since the ice age

The world does seem to like to do periods of hot and periods of cold, it also likes to occasionally swap the magnetic poles over when it gets bored. Can't really see that it has a problem....... historically it has never found a problem getting new tenants in

 

[Bucket on wheels]

 

[Lancs Lad]

Ok been pondering this for a bit...
Atm there's 30odd million cars registered in UK.
Say if 5 million were electric...and work on 50kw per charge ...
That's 2.5gw of leccy...right that's 2.5 nuclear power stations...
Where do folk think this leccy is coming from?
Bear in mind that there's huge push to move to heat pumps etc which also could double a normal household consumption.
All very rough calcs but you get the idea.
The belief that leccy is clean and more will just come from solar and wind farms is a pipe dream but I suppose I'm missing the point...it's all about a good conscience and Mr Ponce in the city feeling holier than us bumpkins who know nothing.

 

[Diggerdavey]

Ok been pondering this for a bit...
Atm there's 30odd million cars registered in UK.
Say if 5 million were electric...and work on 50kw per charge ...
That's 2.5gw of leccy...right that's 2.5 nuclear power stations...
Where do folk think this leccy is coming from?
Bear in mind that there's huge push to move to heat pumps etc which also could double a normal household consumption.
All very rough calcs but you get the idea.
The belief that leccy is clean and more will just come from solar and wind farms is a pipe dream but I suppose I'm missing the point...it's all about a good conscience and Mr Ponce in the city feeling holier than us bumpkins who know nothing.

I agree. I can’t help thinking this is nothing to do with the environment and more about business and selling more products to us mere mortals. There is no very green way to produce power if you look at the infrastructure and materials needed to produce wind farms and solar arrays not to mention the environmental impact when it comes time to dispose of lithium batteries, solar panels and fibre glass wind turbines.
As far as I can see the greenest motoring would be to build a car that lasts a lifetime, concentrating on fuel efficiency rather than what’s coming out of the tailpipe. But this of course does not generate revenue for large corporations or government

 

[Lancs Lad]

I agree. I can’t help thinking this is nothing to do with the environment and more about business and selling more products to us mere mortals. There is no very green way to produce power if you look at the infrastructure and materials needed to produce wind farms and solar arrays not to mention the environmental impact when it comes time to dispose of lithium batteries, solar panels and fibre glass wind turbines.
As far as I can see the greenest motoring would be to build a car that lasts a lifetime, concentrating on fuel efficiency rather than what’s coming out of the tailpipe. But this of course does not generate revenue for large corporations or government

Think your not far off there. You look at current new vehicles...there's not one I'd dare keep out if warranty ...
Grenadier looks only one...but still few unknowns...put deposit down so let's see but it's got proper engine under the hood

 

[TiltyShaun]

Ok been pondering this for a bit...
Atm there's 30odd million cars registered in UK.
Say if 5 million were electric...and work on 50kw per charge ...
That's 2.5gw of leccy...right that's 2.5 nuclear power stations...
Where do folk think this leccy is coming from?
Bear in mind that there's huge push to move to heat pumps etc which also could double a normal household consumption.
All very rough calcs but you get the idea.
The belief that leccy is clean and more will just come from solar and wind farms is a pipe dream but I suppose I'm missing the point...it's all about a good conscience and Mr Ponce in the city feeling holier than us bumpkins who know nothing.

Electrification is about moving emissions from the city. In the city the rich will be able to charge there cars, the rest can get on the bus!!
As for where the electric comes from. The plebs will be priced out of wanting it!!

 

[Smiffy]

At what point do we realize the answer is less not more
Less people less consumption less plastic tat.
If we don't reduce everything we may aswell reduce nothing.

I think we should reduce alot of things just because I think modern consumerism is disgusting.

And besides was it this thread that someone put up the link about water vapour contributing more to the greenhouse effect more than CO2.

 

[Giles]

Ok been pondering this for a bit...
Atm there's 30odd million cars registered in UK.
Say if 5 million were electric...and work on 50kw per charge ...
That's 2.5gw of leccy...right that's 2.5 nuclear power stations...
Where do folk think this leccy is coming from?
Bear in mind that there's huge push to move to heat pumps etc which also could double a normal household consumption.
All very rough calcs but you get the idea.
The belief that leccy is clean and more will just come from solar and wind farms is a pipe dream but I suppose I'm missing the point...it's all about a good conscience and Mr Ponce in the city feeling holier than us bumpkins who know nothing.

I believe the ideas is the charging connected cars act as battery’s and can feed into the grid when demand requires it, not 50kw all at once most will charge off 13amp over night. My uncles got huge solar array and Tesla wall bank to charge his p90 ludicrous at night.

 

[GazCro]

I believe the ideas is the charging connected cars act as battery’s and can feed into the grid when demand requires it, not 50kw all at once most will charge off 13amp over night. My uncles got huge solar array and Tesla wall bank to charge his p90 ludicrous at night.

That's all well and good but who's gonna want to put there car on charge to top it up ready for morning only to find they need to nip out for a pint of milk at 9 at night only to find cars flat cos everyone put kettle on when coronation street finished. Great in theory but in practice.........

 

[Diggerdavey]

That's all well and good but who's gonna want to put there car on charge to top it up ready for morning only to find they need to nip out for a pint of milk at 9 at night only to find cars flat cos everyone put kettle on when coronation street finished. Great in theory but in practice.........

Valid point. As far as I can see this is not the solution. How are people who live in flats or terraced houses going to charge their cars? Who is paying all the compensation for people tripping over the extension leads

 

[Monkeybusiness]

That's all well and good but who's gonna want to put there car on charge to top it up ready for morning only to find they need to nip out for a pint of milk at 9 at night only to find cars flat cos everyone put kettle on when coronation street finished. Great in theory but in practice.........

Yes and no - that is the perception but smart meters would work it all out and there would be a base-line of charge that nothing would drop below - your car would always be ready to go, but it might be just below full range (which wouldn’t be a problem for the bulk of car users who only make short commuter journeys each day, well below maximum range).
Taken in conjunction with renewable energy production it starts to make sense, as storage is the main stumbling block of all green energy. Micro-storage across the grid essentially creates an enormous battery that smooths out the peaks and troughs of consumer demand.
To work it would need a totally new approach to (and acceptance of) energy usage and I’m not sure how UK consumers could ever be ‘retrained’ to accept such a system. Panic buying bogroll and petrol proves what a moronic selfish bunch of twats we are - people would simply charge to 100% and unplug I’d imagine..

 

[GazCro]

Yes and no - that is the perception but smart meters would work it all out and there would be a base-line of charge that nothing would drop below - your car would always be ready to go, but it might be just below full range (which wouldn’t be a problem for the bulk of car users who only make short commuter journeys each day, well below maximum range).
Taken in conjunction with renewable energy production it starts to make sense, as storage is the main stumbling block of all green energy. Micro-storage across the grid essentially creates an enormous battery that smooths out the peaks and troughs of consumer demand.
To work it would need a totally new approach to (and acceptance of) energy usage and I’m not sure how UK consumers could ever be ‘retrained’ to accept such a system. Panic buying bogroll and petrol proves what a moronic selfish bunch of twats we are - people would simply charge to 100% and unplug I’d imagine..

Smart meters oh yeah those meters the govt want us all to have so they can switch 1000s of houses of when grid can't meet demand for 15 mins.

 

[Smiffy]

Yes and no - that is the perception but smart meters would work it all out and there would be a base-line of charge that nothing would drop below - your car would always be ready to go, but it might be just below full range (which wouldn’t be a problem for the bulk of car users who only make short commuter journeys each day, well below maximum range).
Taken in conjunction with renewable energy production it starts to make sense, as storage is the main stumbling block of all green energy. Micro-storage across the grid essentially creates an enormous battery that smooths out the peaks and troughs of consumer demand.
To work it would need a totally new approach to (and acceptance of) energy usage and I’m not sure how UK consumers could ever be ‘retrained’ to accept such a system. Panic buying bogroll and petrol proves what a moronic selfish bunch of twats we are - people would simply charge to 100% and unplug I’d imagine..

Actually they have a solution that is far more efficient and environmentally friendly than batteries and it's been around for a long time. Look up the electric mountain.
This is on a huge scale but can be implemented on smaller scales.
It takes 15seconds to go from 0 to 100% production. Which no power station could manage. It uses water as an energy store by pumping it uphill and releasing it onto turbines. The basic theory is probably a few hundred years old as is just like a mill pond on a vast scale.
At the moment batteries are a gimmick and basically pissing in the wind.
Not to say this won't change but until a breakthrough happens batteries arnt the answer, maybe part of it at best.
The problem is the actual solution's arnt as attention grabbing so get brushed under the carpet for the time being

 

[Lancs Lad]

Still not sure everyone's getting just how much power these cars actually take ...ok not everyone is flat at the same time etc etc...but 50 KW is 50 KW. That's 8 hours at 6kw...for instance .
Presume you know it's impossible to run a car charger from a terrace house due to loop feed.
(Apart from the 2kw 13a jobs)
Battery's fir storage in theory but still needs charging...

 

[Monkeybusiness]

Actually they have a solution that is far more efficient and environmentally friendly than batteries and it's been around for a long time. Look up the electric mountain.
This is on a huge scale but can be implemented on smaller scales.
It takes 15seconds to go from 0 to 100% production. Which no power station could manage. It uses water as an energy store by pumping it uphill and releasing it onto turbines. The basic theory is probably a few hundred years old as is just like a mill pond on a vast scale.
At the moment batteries are a gimmick and basically pissing in the wind.
Not to say this won't change but until a breakthrough happens batteries arnt the answer, maybe part of it at best.
The problem is the actual solution's arnt as attention grabbing so get brushed under the carpet for the time being

There aren’t any other electric mountains in planning (which is a massive shame), and environmental woke badger-huggers would immediately stop the build of anything new anyway.
We live on an island with one of the highest tidal ranges on the planet - a relatively infinite source of predictable power just waiting to be harnessed!!
We can’t dam a couple of large estuaries and create the greenest electricity possible as it might displace a couple of seals etc though - it’s political suicide to try and make it happen so it never will.
We are ruined as a society…
Brunel and Telford must be turning in their graves!

 

[Monkeybusiness]

Yes and no - that is the perception but smart meters would work it all out and there would be a base-line of charge that nothing would drop below - your car would always be ready to go, but it might be just below full range (which wouldn’t be a problem for the bulk of car users who only make short commuter journeys each day, well below maximum range).
Taken in conjunction with renewable energy production it starts to make sense, as storage is the main stumbling block of all green energy. Micro-storage across the grid essentially creates an enormous battery that smooths out the peaks and troughs of consumer demand.
To work it would need a totally new approach to (and acceptance of) energy usage and I’m not sure how UK consumers could ever be ‘retrained’ to accept such a system. Panic buying bogroll and petrol proves what a moronic selfish bunch of twats we are - people would simply charge to 100% and unplug I’d imagine..

It might not sound like it but I think electric cars are a load of bollox by the way!
I do see a place for small commuter/shopping/school run cars (with a 100ish mile range) to be electric, and work as a combined grid battery as described, but having just electric cars across the board is a ridiculous proposal that solves no environmental issues.