Case cx 130 overcooling

[Vinpetrol]

Usually energised to freewheel, so when not energised it should be fixed. Therefore, in theory, if it’s not working then it could be fixed and over cooling. Thats my understanding of it anyway, I’m no expert at all. Ive got more than one machine with this rumour of clutch on the fan.

The engine is an Isuzu 4BG1T fitted to loads of Japanese and Korean excavators , Hitachi , kobelco, sumitomo, doosan, I assumed it’s just a fixed fan but not absolutely certain .
maybe someone who has the same engine might know ?

 

[Shovelhands]

The engine is an Isuzu 4BG1T fitted to loads of Japanese and Korean excavators , Hitachi , kobelco, sumitomo, doosan, I assumed it’s just a fixed fan but not absolutely certain .
maybe someone who has the same engine might know ?

I don’t have anything with that engine. But do have a 6cyl Isuzu which I’m sure has it. And I think the fan type will probably be down to the specific machine manufacturer, possibly not just what comes on the crate engine ?

 

[V8Druid]

I don’t have anything with that engine. But do have a 6cyl Isuzu which I’m sure has it. And I think the fan type will probably be down to the specific machine manufacturer, possibly not just what comes on the crate engine ?

certainly worth investigating, as the fail safe position would certainly produce what the symptoms are describing

 

[T whiting]

What engine is in your duck Tom ?

It's a isuzu 445Ta/MLL but from my looking for a injector pump it looks like the wx125 and the new holland equivalent are the only places that motor lives

 

[Vinpetrol]

Usually energised to freewheel, so when not energised it should be fixed. Therefore, in theory, if it’s not working then it could be fixed and over cooling. Thats my understanding of it anyway, I’m no expert at all. Ive got more than one machine with this type of clutch on the fan.

I’m not seeing any wiring near the fan , just a belt drive . How would it work ?

 

[Vinpetrol]

I blocked off half the rad and it hasn’t made a difference ! The water temp sits between 69 and 70 .
I opened up the bucket ram relief and held it open until the hydraulic oil got to 70degrees and it made no difference.
bottom right hand gauge is oil temp next one up is coolant

 

[Vinpetrol]

Block 3/4 of the rad off and made no difference initially but when I held open the bucket ram again and got the hydraulic oil temp to rise the temp climbed to 75 and I got a wee bit of warm air at heater . I would think that’s hotter than normal running temp for the oil though ?

 

[craig]

View attachment 22363

It's a isuzu 445Ta/MLL but from my looking for a injector pump it looks like the wx125 and the new holland equivalent are the only places that motor lives

Are you sure its an Isuzu, the 445ta number looks more like an Iveco/CNH/cummins number?

 

[T whiting]

Sorry yes it is a Iveco I don't know where I've got isuzu in my head from I did that the other day too

 

[Vinpetrol]

I’ve removed the heater matrix hoses and back washed the matrix out . Only a couple of bits came out certainly nothing that I would of thought would block it . Coolant looked good too.
it made no difference to the heater in the cab it is still blowing cold .
the temperature isn’t really getting above 70 degrees in the block unless I force the oil temperature up by holding the bucket open but then the oil temp gets up to 70 and I don’t want to over heat the oil.
Would 70 degrees show some heat from the heater ? Its pretty much cold .
I am wondering if my new stat is opening up at to low a temp ?
I can’t see any wires going to the fan to operate a clutch unless it’s mechanical?

cheers

vin

 

[Vinpetrol]

Ok , I’m looking for new theories as I’m stumped just now .
it looks like my original stat was ok . It opened up in the pan above 82 degrees although the seal around it was badly perished.
could the pump be weak ? Maybe The hot water would rise in the block possibly enough to open the stat but the pump might not be good enough to push it around very fast but just enough for the rad to cool it down . then maybe not enough go in the pump to push it through the heater ?

 

[craig]

Not sure what type of water pump that has, but I`ve seen water pumps where the impeller was plastic, and had come away from its spindle, (the pulley turns but not the impeller) but usually that gives overheating symptoms.
But if the engine thermosyphons it might run without overheating

 

[craig]

I cant remember if you`ve said, but are the heater pipes from the engine to the matrix hot/warm?

 

[V8Druid]

heater matrix air locking perhaps Vin or as said ... water pump impeller not in full contact with spindle and not spinning so well once warmed up ... I too would expect engine overheat issues if it were the case .... but yer never know ... might be enough thermal flow to keep it circulating?
are you working the machine at all or just have it 'running' trying to sort the issue, without loading the power unit at all ?
an you jury rig some hoses onto the heater ports at the water pump/thermo housing and see what sort of flow you are/aren't getting ....
say a couple of 4 ft lengths with a funnel in the return and the feed open into the funnel ... keep it high and should gravity back into the block ... would give you an idea of flow at least and if it's poor -- pump'd be the next thing to address

 

[Vinpetrol]

Not sure what type of water pump that has, but I`ve seen water pumps where the impeller was plastic, and had come away from its spindle, (the pulley turns but not the impeller) but usually that gives overheating symptoms.
But if the engine thermosyphons it might run without overheating

Ive been looking for that word thermosyphons!
yes I think that something like this must be happening. I ran it by Angus the fitter last night and he thinks it sounds a bit illogical as would expect overheating with pump issues but nothing else left that could be causing it so new water pump is on its way .

 

[Vinpetrol]

I cant remember if you`ve said, but are the heater pipes from the engine to the matrix hot/warm?

Just Warm

 

[Vinpetrol]

heater matrix air locking perhaps Vin or as said ... water pump impeller not in full contact with spindle and not spinning so well once warmed up ... I too would expect engine overheat issues if it were the case .... but yer never know ... might be enough thermal flow to keep it circulating?
are you working the machine at all or just have it 'running' trying to sort the issue, without loading the power unit at all ?
an you jury rig some hoses onto the heater ports at the water pump/thermo housing and see what sort of flow you are/aren't getting ....
say a couple of 4 ft lengths with a funnel in the return and the feed open into the funnel ... keep it high and should gravity back into the block ... would give you an idea of flow at least and if it's poor -- pump'd be the next thing to address

I’m just going to try the pump now as I can’t think what else it can possibly be . The fan is definitely fixed to pulley

 

[mart1602]

yeah fixed fan on that motor just belt drive ,i would think if engine temp is 70 you would get warm air out of the heater does it have digital temp adjustment ? could be faulty making aircon to work

 

[Vinpetrol]

yeah fixed fan on that motor just belt drive ,i would think if engine temp is 70 you would get warm air out of the heater does it have digital temp adjustment ? could be faulty making aircon to work

Yes it does have digital temp and it does have air con . Have you come across this before ? The air con icon isn’t lit and I’m about to remove the belt from the air con motor as I never use it any way

 

[mart1602]

havent come across it before ,if you remove the aircon belt you will soon see if thats the problem though