T
Tacitus
Active member
Interesting answers. However you miss the point.
The fact that two batteries together "work" is stating the obvious. Of course they work, they do until they stop working. If you have dual batteries, you know when you replace them that one will still be good but you will replace both. A modern electronic dual battery system, can prevent one battery killing the other too early.
The anecdote about battery lasting 20 years or 1 are also irrelevant, that has more to do with how they were built and the life they had.
I have dual batteries in my 4wd, in my generator and in my boat. I replaced batteries many times always in pairs and there was always one dead and one still good in the 4wd that has no dual system. The boat has dual system and the battery go for 10 years and go down together, and so does the generator.
None has a house battery and a crank battery, they do all duties together. The boat has a system that allows to select battery one, battery 2 or both. charges both at the same time from the alternator or the solar panel, and keeps them separate when the engine stops.
In a big rig that costs a million dollars, to go out of your way to preserve the battery and make them last one more year is probably very low in the priorities.
But anyway, I am not trying to convince anyone to do something, especially those who threaten with slaps. Too dangerous.
What I am saying is common knowledge, not a secret I found out by myself, so perhaps, if you want to extract an extra year out of your batteries, you can do some reading. If replacing two batteries is a non issue, don't bother. The battery manufacturers will be richer for it ... or the dual system manufacturers, either way someone wins
The fact that two batteries together "work" is stating the obvious. Of course they work, they do until they stop working. If you have dual batteries, you know when you replace them that one will still be good but you will replace both. A modern electronic dual battery system, can prevent one battery killing the other too early.
The anecdote about battery lasting 20 years or 1 are also irrelevant, that has more to do with how they were built and the life they had.
I have dual batteries in my 4wd, in my generator and in my boat. I replaced batteries many times always in pairs and there was always one dead and one still good in the 4wd that has no dual system. The boat has dual system and the battery go for 10 years and go down together, and so does the generator.
None has a house battery and a crank battery, they do all duties together. The boat has a system that allows to select battery one, battery 2 or both. charges both at the same time from the alternator or the solar panel, and keeps them separate when the engine stops.
In a big rig that costs a million dollars, to go out of your way to preserve the battery and make them last one more year is probably very low in the priorities.
But anyway, I am not trying to convince anyone to do something, especially those who threaten with slaps. Too dangerous.
What I am saying is common knowledge, not a secret I found out by myself, so perhaps, if you want to extract an extra year out of your batteries, you can do some reading. If replacing two batteries is a non issue, don't bother. The battery manufacturers will be richer for it ... or the dual system manufacturers, either way someone wins
Shovelhands
Well-known member
I replace both batteries every year, just to be safe
V8Druid
do it as well as you can,but learn to do it better
Bri963
Well-known member
i fail to see what point we’re supposed to be missing here. I replace one battery when it’s done, you replace both including the one that’s okay. Who’s making the battery manufacturers richer, despite however much you’ve spent on your smart system?Interesting answers. However you miss the point.
The fact that two batteries together "work" is stating the obvious. Of course they work, they do until they stop working. If you have dual batteries, you know when you replace them that one will still be good but you will replace both. A modern electronic dual battery system, can prevent one battery killing the other too early.
The anecdote about battery lasting 20 years or 1 are also irrelevant, that has more to do with how they were built and the life they had.
I have dual batteries in my 4wd, in my generator and in my boat. I replaced batteries many times always in pairs and there was always one dead and one still good in the 4wd that has no dual system. The boat has dual system and the battery go for 10 years and go down together, and so does the generator.
None has a house battery and a crank battery, they do all duties together. The boat has a system that allows to select battery one, battery 2 or both. charges both at the same time from the alternator or the solar panel, and keeps them separate when the engine stops.
In a big rig that costs a million dollars, to go out of your way to preserve the battery and make them last one more year is probably very low in the priorities.
But anyway, I am not trying to convince anyone to do something, especially those who threaten with slaps. Too dangerous.
What I am saying is common knowledge, not a secret I found out by myself, so perhaps, if you want to extract an extra year out of your batteries, you can do some reading. If replacing two batteries is a non issue, don't bother. The battery manufacturers will be richer for it ... or the dual system manufacturers, either way someone wins
As for “anecdotes“ about battery life, I can’t say that I like your implication, but you believing it or not makes no difference to what I’ve seen; sometimes we need to accept that other peoples experiences don’t always back up our expertise. That way we all learn a bit more.
JD450A
Feral as Fk 🐾
If you do some reading you could extract a extra year out of them.... if you extracted enough you could have enough time to look young and handsome again.
Gecko
Well-known member
Careful - you are saying some one else's anecdote is irrelevant, but your anecdote is on topic.
Bri963
Well-known member
What are you up to there? Bit early for BAUMA.
Gecko
Well-known member
Nothing so dedicated.
Having a break from perpetual summer in the tropics and taking the opportunity to pickup a box of JCB parts ordered from hcparts.
(I've checked in weirder things in my luggage!).
JD450A
Feral as Fk 🐾
Can you come and pick my right driving glove up whilst your here, it's got a job to do down your side of the hemisphere
Gecko
Well-known member
I don't want to know where that's been - do I?Can you come and pick my right driving glove up whilst your here, it's got a job to do down your side of the hemisphere
Lancs Lad
Well-known member
All 6 fingers of it
JD450A
Feral as Fk 🐾
That's the left one.... No use using your dominant hand.....
Shovelhands
Well-known member
The stranger….
Bri963
Well-known member
You’ll probably get your parts quicker than I can get them through Watling JCB half a mile away.
Gecko
Well-known member
The parts arrived three days before I did - 'spose I should open the box and see if I got what I ordered.
hcparts do a mix of OEM and non-OEM parts. Their prices are very good, but I'm wondering if anyone has any feedback on the quality of their non-EOM parts? I'd guess most would be from india given the number of JCB's sold there. Interestingly, hcparts prices were better than ordering direct from india.
(prices in Oz are frightening for this stuff)
Bri963
Well-known member
There’s a JCB factory in India. Not far from Terex India. Terex made a backhoe out there, if I remember correctly, the 760 which originally had an Indian OEM engine. JCB backhoes were outselling them hands down until they fitted a Perkins mechanical engine, then it took off. Don’t know whether it’s still in production or if they replaced it with the 860 that they used to build in the UK. Sod all to do with batteries, I know. Many Terex backhoes in Oz?
Gecko
Well-known member
I've seen a few Fermec and Terex machines, but not common.
The backhoe market is dominated by JCB, Cat and John Deere with a scattering of Volvo, New Holland, Case, Terex and Komatsu
This page will give you an indication of asking prices (halve the price for gbp)
Quality Backhoes for Sale | Find Your Backhoe Today
Find top backhoe loaders for sale! Caterpillar, John Deere, JCB - get durable backhoe equipment for your construction needs.
www.tradefarmmachinery.com.au
T
Tacitus
Active member
The conversation is about batteries. How they degrade and why. And how it is possible to slow down degradation and make them last and be reliable for longer.
Not particularly exciting topic.
Batteries are not very expensive. The only thing that makes them important is that if they fail you can't start the engine. Rather annoying.
I posted the few reasons that affect battery life, under the assumption that someone may be interested. Sharing is the basis of a forum. I know a bit about batteries, someone else may know how to take the alternator out of a TB016, and tell me because I don't know.
That's all. Everyone is still free to do as they please.
In your case, if you have dual batteries and one is dead and you replace one, you are doing yourself a disfavour. The older battery will discharge the new one as if you had a parasitic power loss. The loss will be proportional to the level of degradation in the old one. To have an old battery and a new one together all the time is like leaving a light on.
To avoid this, you have a solenoid between the two batteries. When you stop the engine, the old battery will be on it's own and will still be able to give what it has left, without discharging the new one.
Simple.
If you read my post in full, you will see that I have to replace both, only in the vehicle that does not have a dual system in place. The others go for much longer precisely for that reason.
As for the anecdote (stories) about long or short battery life, the stories abound and are not relevant to the point. There is no implication that the story is untrue, only that the life of a battery on it's own, is a factor of its construction and the demand it is placed under, not to mention the environment it works in.
As for environment, here goes an anecdote of my own.
The two batteries in the boat go for longer than the one on the generator. This puzzled me at first, but I think I found a reason. The boat is moored in the water and wind and passing vessels move the boat a few times a day. The electrolyte in the batteries is stirred gently and it's sulfuric acid concentration remains even top to bottom as it happen in a car, or machine that moves around.The generator is obviously static and the batteries are sitting on the concrete floor. The acid molecules are heavier than water and go slowly to the bottom, and the top of the plates in the cell sit in almost pure water. The process of charging does produce some gas that should mix the electrolyte, but the number of times the generator is used, does not compare to the times the boat rocks back and forth.
And lastly there are the myth and legend about batteries. They are very amusing and I encourage you to post them if you heard one.
Someone told me that concrete kills a battery sitting on it.
In fact a colder environment like sitting on concrete will make a battery last longer then in a hot environment.
Anyway, this was entertaining.
Hooroo
Marc
JD450A
Feral as Fk 🐾
This forum is built on a fair bit of community, humour and actual expertise..... The sharing comes after those things on here not before.
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