Sorting out the drainage in the lower field and other gubbins. An apprentice digger driver writes.

[LKSF]

I think there is a lot of enjoyment to be had from learning new things. Before last September i'd never owned, driven or fixed a 4 x 4, an excavator, a dumper. Had never come across a Victorian land drain, had a field which floods and god knows how many other interesting experiences.

So we've taken on a place halfway down a hill on the Pennines. In Winter it's very wet and windy and it wants to join us in the house and flood the fields.
Centuries ago all this was forest, but as mankind progressed all the trees came down to make way for open land to graze cattle on, this was known as 'Disafforestation' and has led to various problems, some of them being clay, wet and boggy land which is of poor quality.
The Victorians invented land drainage, they didn't have plastic pipes back then and labour was cheap, material expensive. They watched the land and the rain before setting to work by digging trenches. In these they laid a set of flat stones like a path to a fall (although I believe some drainage didn't have these as a base, but failed because of this) on either side of these they built a dry stone wall. This was then capped off with a flat stone on top and the soil put back over it.
So you basically had a stone tunnel to carry the water from A to B and also for it to seep in from the sides to drain the land around it so it works just like it's modern equivalent, the perforated land drainage pipe.
The work they put in to do this was vast, you yourself probably know how tough it is digging through clay with a machine, (I do!) imagine doing it by hand and then building stone tunnels in there too.

Here i've dug down to expose the capping stone and am levering it off to find something which is circa 150yrs old, but still running fine:

Looking through it:

They are known as 'Soughs' and are placed in strategic places under the fields all over the place. I've had to learn how to read a field to find them, but even then many are still undiscovered.
The best ones work on the principle that when it really does rain and snow heavily the water rushes through at such a rate it flushes them out. Of course this can't happen to all of them, especially when the ground doesn't have much fall on it so they can become blocked. Some just naturally collapse for various reasons, others have been flattened in places due to modern heavy tractors being driven over them.
Then you've got problems.

If you were to map out the soughs on your fields it would look like a road map of the UK, this Sough ^ I've named the M1. It meanders from top to bottom and takes a lot of water. At peak flow it will shift more than a 3" drainage pipe can handle when totally full and flowing. I know this as someone has tried to fix it by putting such a pipe in, but it hasn't worked, it still bubbles up and goes overland.

This is Terry:

Terry isn't happy and neither am I. Two weeks previous we were scampering through that just fine, but after a struggle that day he was up to his axles in it.

Terry's mate came to pull him out as he had a lift kit, winch and better tyres. Rock hard:

Terry's mate also got stuck, I didn't have the JCB back then.

These are some of the tools we used to drag them both out:

Some of you will recognise a ground anchor (which I made), but it wasn't 100% effective. The ground was so soft it pulled it through and out when we coupled the winch up to it. In the end we had more success hammering the steel pole in and winching off that.
We started at lunchtime thinking in a few hrs we'd be done, we finally got free at 10pm on one cold, wet Winters night. Both covered head to toe in wet mud.
I'd previously warned him he could well end up staying the night here!

That's probably why he never gave up. I helped out and tethered Terry to the back of his as we dragged everything slowly back up the hills to the old farmhouse.

More to follow if you're interested?

 

[Steve]

I had a Terrano a few years ago they were good trucks with a limited slip diff in the rear.

 

[Mogman]

Great story think Terry needs some Tommy tracks fitted

 

[LKSF]

Apparently Terry will run on veggie oil too. This was last November when storm whatsisface hit, we're down below this road and I could hear the odd voice on the force 10 Northerly. I figured something was going on up there so went up for a look and pulled a couple of stuck cars out:

This guy was just out having fun:

As you say Terrys are pretty strong and capable with a rear LSD. You can select 2wd, 4wd high or low. It has no viscous coupler between front and rear so have to select low 4wd only at low speed and on surfaces which allow some slip, if you don't it'll wind up the trans (and you can feel it). Apparently they make good tow cars as are heavy and powerful, but are getting on a bit now and suffering from many age related issues, especially rust. But it's let down at the front with a normal open diff. A company in the US did something called a Lokka which is a locking front diff. For some reason they haven't been able to supply for a while so the Ruskies (yeah I know, Don’t mention the War!) jumped in and copied it calling it a Blokka. I picked a new one up recently in the UK, but haven't fitted it yet. With that and some proper mud tyres it should grip a lot better.
It's the smallest diff i've ever seen!

 

[Lancs Lad]

A local ish...thread! Good stuff

 

[Steve]

Apparently Terry will run on veggie oil too. This was last November when storm whatsisface hit, we're down below this road and I could hear the odd voice on the force 10 Northerly. I figured something was going on up there so went up for a look and pulled a couple of stuck cars out:

View attachment 33917

View attachment 33918

This guy was just out having fun:
View attachment 33919

As you say Terrys are pretty strong and capable with a rear LSD, but it's let down at the front with a normal open diff. A company in the US did something called a Blokka which is a locking front diff. For some reason they haven't been able to supply for a while so the Ruskies (yeah I know) jumped in and copied it calling it a Blokka. I picked a new one up recently in the UK, but haven't fitted it yet. With that and some proper mud tyres it should grip a lot better.
It's the smallest diff i've ever seen!

View attachment 33920

I built a kit car several years ago and fitted a lockka (lock right) it transformed the vehicle. The springs keep it locked but allow it to unlock when cornering.

 

[Gecko]

I built a kit car several years ago and fitted a lockka (lock right) it transformed the vehicle. The springs keep it locked but allow it to unlock when cornering.

Sounds like a Detroit Locker. They have a reputation for making steering 'exciting' when fitted to the front end.

https://www.eaton.com/us/en-us/catalog/differentials/eaton-detroit-locker-differential.models.html

Terry's mate also got stuck, I didn't have the JCB back then.

Just think how stuck you can be next season (when you get the JCB bogged)

 

[V8Druid]

I built a kit car several years ago and fitted a lockka (lock right) it transformed the vehicle. The springs keep it locked but allow it to unlock when cornering.

how does it cope in reverse?

 

[LKSF]

Sorry there was a typo, the originals are Lokkas, have amended it and put some more Terry talk in there.

---

When these start living on your fields you know you've got drainage problems

As said earlier you learn how to read the fields (see the dry line there below the sheep) and the M1 Sough wends it's way down underneath turf meadow (all old fields have names and Tithe numbers). You look for low points, divots and dry parts, where you've got those it's likely a sough is running underneath. I've learned to follow the M1 up the field with a machine as it's the driest way home and you don't get stuck.
Once you've found a point where you think one is you ram a steel bar in time and time again until you hear the hollow ding of it hitting a cap stone. You dig down to make sure it is, then go a bit further down and do it again. You turn your ear to the last hole and listen as it's going down, you're listening for that hollow ding again and it'll come from that last test hole if it's a sough and you're inline.

The M1 sough is blocked part way down though as I've also found out. It's not a new thing either, someone else has been there before us some while ago and more than once too, I found this whilst rummaging about in the rushes:

As you can see it's blocked as it's been badly installed (with no gravel), I cleared it out, but still the M1 overflows.

Time to get a digger down there and see what a mess we could make:

Dug a bit out where it was boiling up, went away and came back when it had cleared. I've actually gone down the outside of the sough there and it's to the right of my trench. If you look up the field there in that pic you'll see dry ground heading up and then to the right. When it gets level with the gate it switches back to the left by the yellow pipe and picks up a stream which comes from the left.

More and more came out, it's bit like Timeteam

There is more in this pic than you realise too. Right there in the middle is something called bluey grey 'Gley'. If you dig for a living maybe you've come across it before, but it's rife all the way up the Pennine ridge and in Scotland. It doesn't want to leave the bucket I know that for sure.

The bright orange stuff up there ^ near my bag is Iron Ochre. It's basically iron ore, water and bacteria working together to make a horrible orange jelly which blocks up drainage.

Due to the blockages it's not had water running through for decades to flush it out. The reverse has been happening. The water runs in carrying silt and gravel, slows down, stops and dumps it there so it backs up and fills up even worse.
If you go in by hand with a shovel it's hard work as it's solid and got many bigger stones in there, you're also digging very low down below your feet so it soon cause severe back ache.

There is a bit more going on here than this, but i'm keeping it plant or ground related for this forum.

 

[LKSF]

Sounds like a Detroit Locker. They have a reputation for making steering 'exciting' when fitted to the front end.

https://www.eaton.com/us/en-us/catalog/differentials/eaton-detroit-locker-differential.models.html

Just think how stuck you can be next season (when you get the JCB bogged)

I don't think this rainy season is over yet! Rain forecast from tonight and all week, but I don't know how much. I've had the 803 a bit stuck, but not totally, as any proper digger driver will tell you they're quite hard to lose completely. The tracks spread the weight better than wheels and if they fail you send the bucket out, dig it in and use the arm to pull yourself out whilst tracking at the same time.
I'm learning all the time what will or won't get stuck and where.

 

[Lancs Lad]

Welcome to Lancashire!

 

[V8Druid]

Sorry there was a typo, the originals are Lokkas, have amended it and put some more Terry talk in there.

---

When these start living on your fields you know you've got drainage problems

View attachment 33926

As said earlier you learn how to read the fields (see the dry line there below the sheep) and the M1 Sough wends it's way down underneath turf meadow (all old fields have names and Tithe numbers). You look for low points, divots and dry parts, where you've got those it's likely a sough is running underneath. I've learned to follow the M1 up the field with a machine as it's the driest way home and you don't get stuck.
Once you've found a point where you think one is you ram a steel bar in time and time again until you hear the hollow ding of it hitting a cap stone. You dig down to make sure it is, then go a bit further down and do it again. You turn your ear to the last hole and listen as it's going down, you're listening for that hollow ding again and it'll come from that last test hole if it's a sough and you're inline.

The M1 sough is blocked part way down though as I've also found out. It's not a new thing either, someone else has been there before us some while ago and more than once too, I found this whilst rummaging about in the rushes:

View attachment 33921





View attachment 33922


As you can see it's blocked as it's been badly installed (with no gravel), I cleared it out, but still the M1 overflows.

Time to get a digger down there and see what a mess we could make:

View attachment 33928

Dug a bit out where it was boiling up, went away and came back when it had cleared. I've actually gone down the outside of the sough there and it's to the right of my trench. If you look up the field there in that pic you'll see dry ground heading up and then to the right. When it gets level with the gate it switches back to the left by the yellow pipe and picks up a stream which comes from the left.

More and more came out, it's bit like Timeteam

View attachment 33929
There is more in this pic than you realise too. Right there in the middle is something called bluey grey 'Gley'. If you dig for a living maybe you've come across it before, but it's rife all the way up the Pennine ridge and in Scotland. It doesn't want to leave the bucket I know that for sure.



View attachment 33930

The bright orange stuff up there ^ near my bag is Iron Ochre. It's basically iron ore, water and bacteria working together to make a horrible orange jelly which blocks up drainage.

View attachment 33931



View attachment 33933

Due to the blockages it's not had water running through for decades to flush it out. The reverse has been happening. The water runs in carrying silt and gravel, slows down, stops and dumps it there so it backs up and fills up even worse.
If you go in by hand with a shovel it's hard work as it's solid and got many bigger stones in there, you're also digging very low down below your feet so it soon cause severe back ache.

There is a bit more going on here than this, but i'm keeping it plant or ground related for this forum.

fascinating ...... that lot must've taken some building by hand 'back in the day'

 

[Steve]

I often look at work like this & it makes me realise how hard it must have been.

 

[Smiffy]

It's worth noting it's not entirely Down to the fall being steep to clear the drainage. If the fall is to steep, water will rush and solids will settle to the bottom. From small particles to bigger lumps and stones resulting in the the sediment build up.
The larger the pipe the shallower the fall.
Modern plastic pipes arent quite as precious as older materials to this idea.

 

[GazCro]

When you get into proper old skool land drainage systems (not nice big flatish areas of land where you can install nice evenly spaced herringbone systems) where they've followed the underground strata you often find it's been ballsed up by someone recent if not just abandoned and unmaintained. The MOST important thing is never discount the old drains even if you are putting some new in alongside or instead of. A lot of people don't join them into new runs or try going above them but the old drains will still always make water and be a problem. Lost count of how many times for the sake of someone digging 4 inch deeper or another few metres further they missed out on sorting a drain.
You often find the old drainage systems weren't necessarily put in to completely drain a field either but just to fix the problem areas and dry the worst bits up.

 

[diggerjones]

When you get into proper old skool land drainage systems (not nice big flatish areas of land where you can install nice evenly spaced herringbone systems) where they've followed the underground strata you often find it's been ballsed up by someone recent if not just abandoned and unmaintained. The MOST important thing is never discount the old drains even if you are putting some new in alongside or instead of. A lot of people don't join them into new runs or try going above them but the old drains will still always make water and be a problem. Lost count of how many times for the sake of someone digging 4 inch deeper or another few metres further they missed out on sorting a drain.
You often find the old drainage systems weren't necessarily put in to completely drain a field either but just to fix the problem areas and dry the worst bits up.

I've been helping my mate draining and its so true what you say. Lots of places we go there's a new system lay over or under the old system. There would be nothing wrong with the original system.

 

[LKSF]

Just think how stuck you can be next season (when you get the JCB bogged)

Who needs to wait until next season? This one isn't over yet

 

[LKSF]

Anyhow, back to the main sough, the M1.
As it meandered around beyond where it was blocked and I wasn't sure where exactly I had to dig about a bit. This meant digging across it (to find it), down it and then veer off a bit when it changed direction. I mentioned earlier it had been blocked for a while, a few decades I think and this was repair No.1 I found:

No. 2 was pictured earlier.

Once I found and uncovered it I fitted a 9" bucket, removed the teeth and went in really, really carefully to clean it out:

Pretty soon it was flowing. Any damage caused has to be repaired by hand so is very time consuming. Like you pointed out when they aren't abused or not looked after they work very well, you can also connect into them with modern pipes like A or B roads which is what I intend to do.

Because of the haphazard way I approached it i'd ended up with bits in different stages which meant thinking outside the box and performing some dodgy manoeuvres. I'd picked up some proper hardwood sleepers for free locally so loaded up the 803 and took them down with me:

Yeah you know what's coming next and don't try this at home kids:

If you operate a new one of these as a professional you'll be pretty good at precise fingertip control, much better than me as a rookie with a sloppy old worn machine. It was edge of the seat, maximum concentration stuff. Engine was set to tickover and i'm using my finger tips because if it snags it'll pull me over. One of the sleepers (which had been roofing members in their second life!) actually split when I was on it, but kept it's shape because of the width of track and ditch so I got away with it.
So that's where we're at with the M1. It's flowing, but still open. I'm half hoping for some heavy rain to see it at full spate. I'll go down as and when and build the sides back up, then put the stones back on the top. The Victorians used local rough slabs, they didn't square them off, but left them as they were. To get the next slab to fit they chiselled it to match the irregular edge of the last. I've got some of that to do, but am also going to cheat a bit. I found some used concrete pavings going free so will bung some of those in too.

 

[LKSF]

Who needs to wait until next season? This one isn't over yet

View attachment 34013

Generally the reeds are dense enough to support you, but this area not only had a lot of standing water i'd also used it a bit too much so it was all mixed up in a stringy, reedy, muddy, clay soup.
Typically this happened on the last few Sqm of the boggy area i'd been working on all afternoon and just as it was about to get dark and me go home. When it gets dark here it really is black. Rain was also due and it was my last job down there for a while.
Walked home fuming.
Went back the next evening and managed to get it moving backwards and forwards a bit by clearing some away with the bucket and by hand. I think it had sunk until it rested on a bed of clay, but was being held back by this stuff collecting in front and behind.
Bit by bit it started to move backwards and forwards more and more. After about an hours work it dragged itself out:

Some of these accounts are a month or two old, some just a few days ago. Generally you can tell by looking at the sky and how dry the land is!

After a lovely sunny, dry March April is due to be be dire looking at the forecast, nothing but wind, rain and snow for much of the UK. Anything with an engine on it is safely back up at the house and won't be going down there for a while.
I've done enough digging, now it's time to sit back and watch how the land reacts. Then when it's drier go back down and tidy up and/or add some more in. More in the form of ditches, aggregates or pipes, we'll see.

 

[LKSF]

Like I said it's all about observing, waiting and learning. What do you think to this:

?
If you can't see it this will help:

It's a band of wet ground, see how the wheels or tracks have sunk in. The red line is a sough drain which is where the wet patch stops as it percolates down, in and runs away. The blue line marks the top of it.
I think this is the edge of a water table. If it is then possibly the only way I could tackle it is to put multiple land drains across it which would be quite expensive.