Gunns Contractors Ltd

[Shovelhands]

Bloody hell .... how many leaks did you have

100% by the sound of it.....

 

[Gunners]

100% by the sound of it.....

This describes it very accurately.... The only bit that didn't leak was the bucket. Most have been fixed either by tightening hose connections or new seals but one persists in the tilt ram valve block which has had all its seals replaced on Saturday so there's something it doesn't like.
The replacement tilty should fix all this (or give me all the leaks back again) but during a conversation with Rory yesterday I realised that after the original 2 day fitting time (which is fair enough, its an investment into my future business) It has cost me a day in downtime so far. Not Engcon's fault I'm so busy and working all the weekends but its got some time saving to make up for that. I'd imagine the fitting of the new one will no doubt take a good couple of hours and rightly so - its got to be right from the start but its not ideal when you are on day rate to a builder who at the end of the day just wants his job done.

FYI the JCB 8026 has been down for 5 days in its 4 year lifetime and 4 of those were within the first year. Teething problems are not unusual and Engcon have and are doing all they can to sort it but just like my beloved JCB, 80% of the issues could of been avoided in the factory and service engineers are expensive to keep sending out - not good for their or my business. I should mention that Shaun Gratton is working hard behind the scenes on this and has been in touch a few times to see how I'm getting on and is taking up my issues direct with Engcon on quality control etc.

On a positive note it seemed to fly today, really getting into controlling tilt, rotate and bucket crowd at the same time. SO glad I went for the full DC2 system. I know I was an advocate of the simpler button and pedal system before but if you are reading this thinking should I save up for the proper control system then I cant recommend it enough, so many jobs require simultaneous tilting and rotating to get in one pass and you wont regret it.

 

[V8Druid]

This describes it very accurately.... The only bit that didn't leak was the bucket. Most have been fixed either by tightening hose connections or new seals but one persists in the tilt ram valve block which has had all its seals replaced on Saturday so there's something it doesn't like. .....
On a positive note it seemed to fly today, really getting into controlling tilt, rotate and bucket crowd at the same time. SO glad I went for the full DC2 system. I know I was an advocate of the simpler button and pedal system before but if you are reading this thinking should I save up for the proper control system then I cant recommend it enough, so many jobs require simultaneous tilting and rotating to get in one pass and you wont regret it.

OMG ..... Friday job by the sound of it .... after all the checks in Gra's video the other day it's pretty remarkable

Not knocking the DC2 Ollie ..... 'tis the mutt's after all, but what sort of pedal/button set up did you try that didn't give you simultaneous motions ??
Let's hope your next tilty is a bit drier

 

[Engcon UK]

This describes it very accurately.... The only bit that didn't leak was the bucket. Most have been fixed either by tightening hose connections or new seals but one persists in the tilt ram valve block which has had all its seals replaced on Saturday so there's something it doesn't like.
The replacement tilty should fix all this (or give me all the leaks back again) but during a conversation with Rory yesterday I realised that after the original 2 day fitting time (which is fair enough, its an investment into my future business) It has cost me a day in downtime so far. Not Engcon's fault I'm so busy and working all the weekends but its got some time saving to make up for that. I'd imagine the fitting of the new one will no doubt take a good couple of hours and rightly so - its got to be right from the start but its not ideal when you are on day rate to a builder who at the end of the day just wants his job done.

FYI the JCB 8026 has been down for 5 days in its 4 year lifetime and 4 of those were within the first year. Teething problems are not unusual and Engcon have and are doing all they can to sort it but just like my beloved JCB, 80% of the issues could of been avoided in the factory and service engineers are expensive to keep sending out - not good for their or my business. I should mention that Shaun Gratton is working hard behind the scenes on this and has been in touch a few times to see how I'm getting on and is taking up my issues direct with Engcon on quality control etc.

On a positive note it seemed to fly today, really getting into controlling tilt, rotate and bucket crowd at the same time. SO glad I went for the full DC2 system. I know I was an advocate of the simpler button and pedal system before but if you are reading this thinking should I save up for the proper control system then I cant recommend it enough, so many jobs require simultaneous tilting and rotating to get in one pass and you wont regret it.

Firstly, I’m sorry that Ollie has had issues with his Engcon. I’m not going to speculate on what they are – that’s one of the reasons I want to swap it so we can find out what’s gone wrong and try and ensure it isn’t repeated. As tilties become more widespread in their use, it’s important that we make sure the product quality and service backup is spot-on and the fact that we’ve had to send out two service engineers to this is regrettable but, ultimately, we need to and will get it right.

A couple of other points whilst I’m writing: Ollie mentioned Shaun in his post. Many of you will know Shaun as a long-standing Engcon owner and more recently we’ve been working with him to try and increase the availability of demonstrations for prospective customers. We have a number of owner-operators around the UK and Ireland who allow us to use their machines to show off what a tilty can do and we do have our own demonstration U25 here, but Shaun can and will travel (within a certain geographical radius of Leek in Staffordshire) with his mini digger. By all means talk to Shaun if you would like a go and aren’t too far from the Staffordshire moorlands. If you have technical or service-related questions talk to us directly, however.

In respect of Druid’s later question, I think Ollie may have been referring to what we call the SS15 system. This uses the foot-operated mechanically-controlled hammer line to regulate the flow and buttons to select the tilt and rotate functions. It’s a good, cost-effective option – particularly on mini diggers – but it does mean that you can’t independently control the flow to the tilt and rotate functions: they both go as fast or as slow as each other, depending on how much you put your foot on the pedal. Ollie and others tried this at our first Big Dig Day and we’ve installed a lot of them since. As Graham said, it’s not DC2; but it is a lower-cost option. Both have their place (and we have other options) and it’s down to user choice and budgets.

 

[TiltyShaun]

Just to follow up on what Robert has said.
Firstly I am not the Shaun in Leek, I am just down the road from Engcon in Tewkesbury. I have the basic set up SS15 on my Kubota and it can tilt and rotate at the same time. What I do find when grading is the machine is not anywhere near full revs, so although the oil flow to the tilt and rotate is the same it is still quite a smooth action when you are operating. I am looking forward to seeing Ollie in action shortly to gain an opinion on what way to go when I upgrade next. I think Ollie has the gripper and grab which I think would be a another good reason to step up too when the time comes.

 

[doobin]

I'd imagine the fitting of the new one will no doubt take a good couple of hours and rightly so - its got to be right from the start but its not ideal when you are on day rate to a builder who at the end of the day just wants his job done.

I think it's brilliant that you've managed to find a builder who appreciates just what can be achieved, and the labour saving. If you don't mind me asking, what sort of day rate does such a rig command?

I don't often use my tilt hitch, but when I do it always puts a smile on my face and can make some serious money. Although I have no tilt rotator, I've invested a lot in other specialised attachments and yesterday I used most of them. I used the grab to remove a Leylandii hedge and load it straight onto the tipper truck.

Then sent my guy back to tip whilst I felled a cherry tree and stockpiled it for removal. Put the ripper on to fight with the stump (and boy did it fight! Just about got it and the digger onto the 10x6 trailer for the return leg!) Swapped over to grab to load again, back to ripper (and used three chains on the saw ) and finished the stump off.
Then, perching on the bank leading to the garden, I profiled the bank whilst using what I removed to fill in the stump hole.

Then it was on with the post knocker, knock in some 10ft straining posts (soft conditions),then strain the wire before grading my way out and loading the buckets into the pickup with the grab! Finished off by hanging a gate and adding some rails to meet the wall. Along with a few 'can you just' shrub and tree removals through the course of the day! Plenty of cups of tea which was nice.

Two men and a digger for the day. Left the yard at at nine (didn't get confirmation until the evening before so had to load in the morning) and were back by six. £1512+VAT. Some would say I marched his granny down the cashpoint. But how long would that job take two guys with a quickhitch and three buckets, and a hammer and handsaw compared to every Makita battery tool and a gas fencing stapler? Not to mention digging strainers by hand and a mandraulic post driver.

It's the same with a tiltrotator.

My pet stump:

 

[fred]

looking at the size of their boat parked up, i think you were a bit cheap mate!

 

[doobin]

looking at the size of their boat parked up, i think you were a bit cheap mate!

That was a small one mate! The job was overlooking a marina, hence why I hauled the waste away rather than burn on site.

Can you imagine the insurance claim if I rained down Leylandii ash over that lot?

 

[Engcon UK]

I don't often use my tilt hitch, but when I do it always puts a smile on my face and can make some serious money. Although I have no tilt rotator, I've invested a lot in other specialised attachments and yesterday I used most of them. I used the grab to remove a Leylandii hedge and load it straight onto the tipper truck.

Very much Scandi philosophy, Doobin Over there, if they've a budget of X for their plant, half of it will go on the attachments.

Hygge.......

 

[doobin]

^What's with all this Hygge mate? My missus was reading a book that was supposed to be it recently. I flicked through and as far as i could tell it was just your standard modern chick lit crap. All about some bird trying to 'find herself' as usual.

 

[Engcon UK]

^What's with all this Hygge mate? My missus was reading a book that was supposed to be it recently. I flicked through and as far as i could tell it was just your standard modern chick lit crap. All about some bird trying to 'find herself' as usual.

Well you started it by saying your tilting hitch brought a smile to your face

You wait - next thing, I'll grow a beard, start wearing chinos to work and relocate the office to Shoreditch.

Good day's work, BTW

 

[Grahams]

Looks a very nice job. If you can achieve all that in a day I would say your price was very fair. Just because you have invested in the right gear you should no be penalised because you do it quick, rather they should be pleased you have done the job efficiently and you off site.
Graham

 

[Gunners]

Two men and a digger for the day. Left the yard at at nine (didn't get confirmation until the evening before so had to load in the morning) and were back by six. £1512+VAT.

That's not bad Doobin, I was looking at your pics thinking you got some serious work done in a day there. With the fencing I'd of guessed it was 2 days work but obviously things worked out and you smashed it out in one day. I certainly wouldn't call it expensive, you are a professional with the correct tools, turn up and do the agreed job plus some by the sounds of it. You make good money doing it and the client is happy, why take more days to do it to satisfy a perceived "value for money" by the customer when you can do it in 1 and earn - you price it, you take the risk and you win... sometimes.

I installed 7 benches for my local parish council last week, having never done it before, I priced at £150 per bench - they supplied the bench I supplied materials and took spare dirt away. God that was a good earner! I was finished by 4, one man, had everything I needed on the trailer and towed it round the park installing. I even had spare ballast and cement left over from a previous job and petrol in the generator. Literally spent £0! And got paid 3 days later. That's what we like

Todays tilt rotator discovery is I can pick up bulk bags with the tilty still on the machine. This is a right result as its something I do a lot and I thought I would have to drop the tilty off but no need - the good old 8026 has my back. Seriously I haven't found something I cant do with it yet, all the perceived compromises I thought I would have to make haven't come true and its putting a smile on my face everyday.

 

[Grahams]

Todays tilt rotator discovery is I can pick up bulk bags with the tilty still on the machine. This is a right result as its something I do a lot and I thought I would have to drop the tilty off but no need - the good old 8026 has my back. Seriously I haven't found something I cant do with it yet, all the perceived compromises I thought I would have to make haven't come true and its putting a smile on my face everyday.

That’s the thing about tiltrotators. You expect it to be good, but after a bit of practice it exceeds your expectations. Wish every thing was like that.
Graham

 

[Engcon UK]

Just to follow up on what Robert has said.
Firstly I am not the Shaun in Leek, I am just down the road from Engcon in Tewkesbury. I have the basic set up SS15 on my Kubota and it can tilt and rotate at the same time. What I do find when grading is the machine is not anywhere near full revs, so although the oil flow to the tilt and rotate is the same it is still quite a smooth action when you are operating. I am looking forward to seeing Ollie in action shortly to gain an opinion on what way to go when I upgrade next. I think Ollie has the gripper and grab which I think would be a another good reason to step up too when the time comes.

Just a more general note here: The gripper range only starts on the EC204 and adds around 50kgs to the weight of the tilty (which is around 116kgs without it). So firstly you need a 2.5 - 4t machine. I've also noticed that with some machines at the lower end of this scale when you have a tilty, gripper, grading bucket and a load of wet muck, they are getting a little noddy. I'm pretty sure I had this conversation with Ollie but I have certainly had it with a lot of other owner-ops. Going for the smaller SK02 grab (which costs around the same as a gripper) is, in some cases, a better option in that you can drop the bucket off and put the grab on and do what you need rather than have the extra weight on all the time.

Basically, the gripper is a really useful tool; but think hard before considering it on anything less than a well-planted 3.5t+ machine.

 

[V8Druid]

^What's with all this Hygge mate? My missus was reading a book that was supposed to be it recently. I flicked through and as far as i could tell it was just your standard modern chick lit crap. All about some bird trying to 'find herself' as usual.

" Pronounced "hoo-ga," this Danish concept cannot be translated to one single word but encompasses a feeling of cozy contentment and well-being through enjoying the simple things in life "

 

[Mogman]

" Pronounced "hoo-ga," this Danish concept cannot be translated to one single word but encompasses a feeling of cozy contentment and well-being through enjoying the simple things in life "

Is that what they used to shout in gladiators on a Saturday night in the 90s

 

[V8Druid]

Just to follow up on what Robert has said.
Firstly I am not the Shaun in Leek, I am just down the road from Engcon in Tewkesbury. I have the basic set up SS15 on my Kubota and it can tilt and rotate at the same time. What I do find when grading is the machine is not anywhere near full revs, so although the oil flow to the tilt and rotate is the same it is still quite a smooth action when you are operating. I am looking forward to seeing Ollie in action shortly to gain an opinion on what way to go when I upgrade next. I think Ollie has the gripper and grab which I think would be a another good reason to step up too when the time comes.

I presume that your size tilty doesn't have a rotary coupling through it Shaun, so no oil flow to enable a gripper/grab/hyd hitch?
otherwise, I see no reason to have to ''step up'' on the control side of things, from your SS15, which you obviously find 'comfortable' enough.

as you all know, my VA-r [Variable Angle rotator, as I call mine] is an SS15 type of control system, but with the 4 gallery rotary I've fitted, I have a hyd hitch and Aux. QCs for grab/grapple/whatever, but still run from my proportional pedal feed.

To be able to attach a gripper to mine, I'd either need to have an electrical slip ring facility, through the rotary, to control a 6x2 diverter, for Aux./gripper, in the lower, lower half .... or install a 6 gallery rotary [which I'm considering, having acquired such a beast, a while back]

To run that I'd either have to fit a 6 x 2 diverter, above my rotator, to have an either / or set up for Aux. / gripper, or fit another Cetop3, to control it [I have two extra, spare buttons], which I could use to control either; a.n.other Cetop, or use just a single button to energise a 6 x 2 diverter. The ideal would be the Cetop route, but there'd be a lot of head scratching as to just where I can physically fit it and its associated plumbing .... it's already very tight in the VA-r's body ............. and therein lies the issue that Engcon, etc. have ..... space!
Even with their ability to manufacture their own manifolds and rotaries to physically fit their constraints, they are still governed by the sheer physical size of the Cetop3 valve blocks and solenoids ... they ain't small ...... so incorporating them into small units is damn nigh 'mission impossible'

going back to the control side of it ..... I know my system is 'old hat/skool', but it's what I am used to and having tried a prop. roller system a few times, I found it incredibly difficult to adapt to .... admittedly I only got a quick 'crack' each time, but I am so used to holding a button, to select whatever motion(s) I want and controlling flow with my left foot, I found myself not letting go of the rollers .... I'd get there with practice, but have no issues with SS15 and am able to control everything simultaneously ..... rotate/tilt/Aux. and even QH if I wanted to ... with the additional plumbing above, it would even be possible to control a gripper simultaneously too...... I'd need an extra left thumb though

SS15 is not the devil it's made out to be, by everyone with DC2, etc., but a very flexible, controllable system in familiar hands [and feet]

............ Druid puts on tin hat and retires behind blast wall

 

[V8Druid]

Is that what they used to shout in gladiators on a Saturday night in the 90s

you actually used to watch Gladiators, Mog?

 

[Shovelhands]

you actually used to watch Gladiators, Mog?

Obviously he did.........Saturday night hottie totty....