Tractor charging

[V8Druid]

What’s the difference between that mini alternator and the ACR 17 /19 you mentioned earlier ?

the back end is slightly different - doesn't have the bolt on pole and is set up for a 3 pin plug in (2 x 10mm and 1 x 6mm spades in a single plug/block -- perfectly acceptable, but what I put up has the B+ pole and separate reg./brush set up too

got to strip a 17 to replace brushes or reg./rec.

 

[Vinpetrol]

the back end is slightly different - doesn't have the bolt on pole and is set up for a 3 pin plug in (2 x 10mm and 1 x 6mm spades in a single plug/block -- perfectly acceptable, but what I put up has the B+ pole and separate reg./brush set up too
View attachment 75764 got to strip a 17 to replace brushes or reg./rec.

The original was a Lucas 12089N
It was a 45amp Alternator that worked with the battery temp sensor .
Will that LRA 602 mini alternator pulley be ok? If so I will order one tomorrow

 

[V8Druid]

The original was a Lucas 12089N
It was a 45amp Alternator that worked with the battery temp sensor .
Will that LRA 602 mini alternator pulley be ok? If so I will order one tomorrow

measure your pulley and give them a call on +44 7500117341

 

[Gecko]

Might be to accomodate a fuel pump but there isn’t one on it as far as I can see

My 3CX was sold as non-turbo.
A brief search found one in the usual location!

 

[Gecko]

No result . It tested with 1 on display and never changed at all .

That pretty well confirms the main rectifier diodes are blown.

Just the issue that your highlighting with the wire that is live all the time buddy . If we can leave that as it is will the wiring as it is just now work with a standard alternator ?

With your mechanically driven Tacho (no need for the W terminal) and dropping the battery sensor, the simplest alternator will suit you perfectly.
The (now spare) black wire back can either be left disconnected (just tape it up and tie off to stop it flapping around), or if you are confident it is hot at all times, you could put a 3/8" (10mm) spade on it and use it in parallel with the brown - this would have some benefit only if you are running significant electrical load. Personally I'd just tape it up and keep it simple.
If you can work out where it goes, disconnecting the far end would be a nice touch.

 

[Canal Navvy]

Could be worth speaking to @ TSM&ACco

 

[Vinpetrol]

That pretty well confirms the main rectifier diodes are blown.

With your mechanically driven Tacho (no need for the W terminal) and dropping the battery sensor, the simplest alternator will suit you perfectly.
The (now spare) black wire back can either be left disconnected (just tape it up and tie off to stop it flapping around), or if you are confident it is hot at all times, you could put a 3/8" (10mm) spade on it and use it in parallel with the brown - this would have some benefit only if you are running significant electrical load. Personally I'd just tape it up and keep it simple.
If you can work out where it goes, disconnecting the far end would be a nice touch.

So with big standard alternator I won’t need an exciter wire ? Or does the brown /yellow do that ?

 

[Vinpetrol]

Could be worth speaking to @ TSM&ACco

Do they do alternators ?
I just googled them and got a co that sells leather goods !

 

[doobin]

Have a go !

But maybe not with three phase…

 

[V8Druid]

But maybe not with three phase…

no sense of adventure ... nothing wrong with 3 ph - just needs three times more respect when dealing with it -
used to (and still) do all my own --
was constantly replacing so called professional's wiring, in the shop, when it melted, due to skimping on sizing, or poorly made connections
it just makes you far more methodical in what you do (if you've any sense of self preservation) seen some stuff'd make you wince

did have the main fuses smoking occasionally if everyone was welding at the same time (100A per leg supply)

 

[Gecko]

So with big standard alternator I won’t need an exciter wire ? Or does the brown /yellow do that ?

Yes - you'll need two wires - the heavy Brown to take the high charge current and the Brown/Yellow for exciter (and dash lamp)
The world became a better place when alternators with internal regulators became standard!

 

[Lancs Lad]

no sense of adventure ... nothing wrong with 3 ph - just needs three times more respect when dealing with it -
used to (and still) do all my own --
was constantly replacing so called professional's wiring, in the shop, when it melted, due to skimping on sizing, or poorly made connections
it just makes you far more methodical in what you do (if you've any sense of self preservation) seen some stuff'd make you wince

did have the main fuses smoking occasionally if everyone was welding at the same time (100A per leg supply)

You only had a 100a supply?

 

[Vinpetrol]

Today is a good day tractoring .
I found this on line when trying to get the original alternator number and I found this

No Picture​

Alternator - Lucas Style (12089N) - For Ford tractor models 2310, 2600 (, N, R, V), 2610, 2810, 2910, 3600 (, N, NO, R, V), 3610, 3900, 3910 (, H, N, R), 4100, 4110, 4600, 4600SU, 4610, 4610SU, 5110, 5600, 5610, 5700, 5900, 6600, 6610, 6700, 6710, 6810, 7410, 7600, 7610, 7700, 7710, 9030, Compatible with Ford Construction and industrial models 230A, 231, 233, 234, 333, 334, 335, 420, 455, 515, 530A, 531, 532, 535, 550, 555, 555A, 555B, 655, 655A, Compatible with Ford Engine (s) BSD332, BSD333, BSD442, BSD444, BSD444T, Replaces Ford OEM number E3NN10B376AB, E3NN10B376AC, E3NN10B376AD, Replaces Lucas manufacturer number LRA00530, Lucas Style, Design: IR/EF, Voltage: 12, Rotation: Clockwise, Amperage: 45, Regulator: Internal, Pulley: Class V1, Single Groove, NOTE 1:Battery sense through external thermistor on vehicle. Do not apply full voltage (14V) to wire, will damage regulator. Need to use 1/4 watt 200 ohm resistor between S-terminal wire (orange) to B+ to test., (Item #: 189295) $123.00


I called the local parts guys and they have a helpful electro diesel guy . I had found out that the original alternator number from the USA ad above was Lucas 12089N .
I explained this to him and that I needed one exactly the same but without the supply from battery thermister . He called me back with the Lucas no 12088N and said they had it in stock and delivered it this afternoon . It’s made by WAI .

I had a go at it when got home , The alternator didn’t have a pulley on it and the spacers and fan on it stopped the pulleys lining up correctly but when I took the old set up fan and spacers off the original alternator it all lined up perfectly .
It’s fitted and charging at 14.4V . When I turn off the ignition with engine running the alt light comes on and also ignition on without engine running so that all seems to be working correctly .
I just need to tidy up the wiring now and put the dash back together .
Thanks to everyone who chipped in your knowledge is really very appreciated .
I defo couldnt of figured it out on own without the forum !

 

[V8Druid]

You only had a 100a supply?

per leg - I did enquire about upping it but they weren't keen on digging up the entire bus station roadway entrance to my place to get to the main out in the road - quoted some eye wateringly silly amount
so every 12-18 months they had to come and replace the main fuses after they'd melted all their pitch insulation on the floor when we were particularly busy
the Bronx press brake had two 30hp motors running the pumps and that got used most days aside from maybe 5 or 6 MIGs on the go and a guillo with a 30horse motor running the pump

had a notice on the guillo and the Bronx to check that the mag drills weren't in use before switching either on -- power dipped enough for the magnet to let go momentarily and bugger the broaches

 

[Lancs Lad]

per leg - I did enquire about upping it but they weren't keen on digging up the entire bus station roadway entrance to my place to get to the main out in the road - quoted some eye wateringly silly amount
so every 12-18 months they had to come and replace the main fuses after they'd melted all their pitch insulation on the floor when we were particularly busy
the Bronx press brake had two 30hp motors running the pumps and that got used most days aside from maybe 5 or 6 MIGs on the go and a guillo with a 30horse motor running the pump

had a notice on the guillo and the Bronx to check that the mag drills weren't in use before switching either on -- power dipped enough for the magnet to let go momentarily and bugger the broaches

That's still what they call a 100a supply. Pretty low for what you were using and low standing charge

 

[Gecko]

It’s fitted and charging at 14.4V .

Congratulations - good result.

 

[Vinpetrol]

Congratulations - good result.

Thanks for all your help

 

[Gecko]

Your welcome.
The stepping through the symptoms to identify / solve a problem is always interesting!

 

[Vinpetrol]

Your welcome.
The stepping through the symptoms to identify / solve a problem is always interesting!

Me too . Even if my knowledge doesn’t match enthusiasm

 

[TiltyShaun]

So that is it then!!! Early to bed tonight with this over!!