The 'Today's Job' thread

[Smiffy]

A large part of it was the old cubicles. Went halves on the crushing part with my landlord (he's a tenant farmer, it's his tractor). Half of the pile will be used for redoing farm tracks. So legal? Although the farm tracks are only being re-done for access to some glamping pods. So not agri.

It's all bullshit.

As regards tractors- there's a local guy with more kit than you can shake a stick at. You think I've got a lot of gear, well he's got stuff ten times as big and ten times the value. Everything from 13ts with tilties to road graders on tractors. All moved on a brand new fastrac- before 8AM or after 5PM as much as I can work out! Yes, he does some farm tracks. But last job was the village hall car park.

A local village has 3 groundworks firms and a demo firm all running plant around on tractors. Some of them are big firms running lorries aswell. Including very big shiny plant lorries. But still do the local stuff on tractors

 

[V8Druid]

A local village has 3 groundworks firms and a demo firm all running plant around on tractors. Some of them are big firms running lorries aswell. Including very big shiny plant lorries. But still do the local stuff on tractors

and it is about time that they were all, countrywide, descended upon from a great height and stopped .... educate plod / DVSA, etc., about what easy nicks they all are and start confiscating gear to add funds to the coffers .... it'll cure a hell of a lot of issues/dissention and 'clarify' the rules once and for all ... abuse 'em and lose it -- all of it
plenty round here like it too

 

[Smiffy]

and it is about time that they were all, countrywide, descended upon from a great height and stopped .... educate plod / DVSA, etc., about what easy nicks they all are and start confiscating gear to add funds to the coffers .... it'll cure a hell of a lot of issues/dissention and 'clarify' the rules once and for all ... abuse 'em and lose it -- all of it
plenty round here like it too

I really don't think tractors should be used as transport. As having driven both tractors moving machines and lorries moving machines. The lorries are just so much safer in every way. However I'm starting to be of the opinion that this country is way to over regulated and that until the powers that be sort there s**t out I think we need more of an approach of do what you like. I am really fed up with stupid rules as per the tacho record thread. Whilst ignoring the ever growing community of people who rob diesel tools and machinery UN hindered.
The world is completely topsy turvy. And I think we should push back at this point.

 

[Storrsy]

Personally I couldn't give a s**t what anyone uses to move stuff around, the more laws broken the better The only proviso is that whatever is used is driven in a sensible manner, suitable for the task and isn't going to put anyone's life at undue risk. If you do then your a twat regardless.

 

[Smiffy]

Personally I couldn't give a s**t what anyone uses to move stuff around, the more laws broken the better The only proviso is that whatever is used is driven in a sensible manner, suitable for the task and isn't going to put anyone's life at undue risk. If you do then your a twat regardless.

That's the problem that people who have never driven a lorry think tractors are safe. Reality is even driven sensibly tractors are not road vehicles. They are brilliant for cultivating but they should stay in the field. America has a separate driving license category for driving lorries for AG purposes. This would be a far better route and use a tractor and transfer trailer in the field with harvesting equipment. Keep the mud and the tractors in the field.

 

[JD450A]

f**k all wrong with tractors when used appropriately. The issue arises with the discrepancy between costs and paperwork to correctly run a HGV and that of a tractor.

A correctly setup fastrac and suspended braked trailer is as safe as a lorry, if not safer in some situations.

The issue is tractors are almost always piloted by 19 year olds high on redbull and Marty mone records, with wannabe chrome light bars, airhorns and stupid f****ng tassle curtains. They are only beaten in retardation by the odd Scania driver.

If the government sorted out a way to run HGVs with less Hassel, tractor lowloaders would soon die out.

 

[Shovelhands]

f**k all wrong with tractors when used appropriately. The issue arises with the discrepancy between costs and paperwork to correctly run a HGV and that of a tractor.

A correctly setup fastrac and suspended braked trailer is as safe as a lorry, if not safer in some situations.

The issue is tractors are almost always piloted by 19 year olds high on redbull and Marty mone records, with wannabe chrome light bars, airhorns and stupid f****ng tassle curtains. They are only beaten in retardation by the odd Scania driver.

If the government sorted out a way to run HGVs with less Hassel, tractor lowloaders would soon die out.

Leave Marty out of this!

 

[Smiffy]

f**k all wrong with tractors when used appropriately. The issue arises with the discrepancy between costs and paperwork to correctly run a HGV and that of a tractor.

A correctly setup fastrac and suspended braked trailer is as safe as a lorry, if not safer in some situations.

I disagree. Tractors do not stop or corner nearly as well as a lorry. I have driven thousands of miles in both. Including some very high end well set up agri setups.
A lorry is far far superior. Not to mention if you try to even remotely run legit the tractor ends up to light and being shunted around by the trailer. Fastraks are the only tractors with air breaks. Everything else is still on hydraulic. So when coupled to an air breaked trailer the breaks don't match. This is particularly bad with new Hollands as they only have a single break disk per side up to about 170hp and only two after that. Most tractors still don't have front breaks.
Even driven sensibly tractors simply handle terribly in comparison to tractors. What's more unless you run road tyres on them which is very rare. Cleated tyres have nowhere near the grip of a lorry tyre. Both pulling away and breaking.

 

[Lancs Lad]

f**k all wrong with tractors when used appropriately. The issue arises with the discrepancy between costs and paperwork to correctly run a HGV and that of a tractor.

A correctly setup fastrac and suspended braked trailer is as safe as a lorry, if not safer in some situations.

The issue is tractors are almost always piloted by 19 year olds high on redbull and Marty mone records, with wannabe chrome light bars, airhorns and stupid f****ng tassle curtains. They are only beaten in retardation by the odd Scania driver.

If the government sorted out a way to run HGVs with less Hassel, tractor lowloaders would soon die out.

I was on the A55 after the ferry had come in yesterday...fk me those scanias move
Deffo a few tassels involved.

 

[JD450A]

I disagree. Tractors do not stop or corner nearly as well as a lorry. I have driven thousands of miles in both. Including some very high end well set up agri setups.
A lorry is far far superior. Not to mention if you try to even remotely run legit the tractor ends up to light and being shunted around by the trailer. Fastraks are the only tractors with air breaks. Everything else is still on hydraulic. So when coupled to an air breaked trailer the breaks don't match. This is particularly bad with new Hollands as they only have a single break disk per side up to about 170hp and only two after that. Most tractors still don't have front breaks.
Even driven sensibly tractors simply handle terribly in comparison to tractors. What's more unless you run road tyres on them which is very rare. Cleated tyres have nowhere near the grip of a lorry tyre. Both pulling away and breaking.

I fear your comparing apples and oranges.

If you expect any tractor to match a lorry on a southbound run down the A38 your going to be saddened.
However Autumn, on A, B and Unclassified local roads will soon show why a tractor can without doubt be a better tool..... wet leaves and lorry's don't go together and the last mile into a job is normally where the incidents will stack up.


FYI to run a Fastrac properly, as with a Unimog you need to be running a either a Tandem balanced suspended trailer like a lorry would tow, or a dolly trailer. About the only time I've ever seen this done is the water board units which where soon phased out when the tachograph/O license requirement was enforced. Which was a pity as now they use 8 leg hooklifts which do nothing but drag mud onto the road, get stuck and quite often wind up in capers.

Regarding tractors not having front brakes, I can't remember the particular limits, but I believe up to 40K is acceptable to run using the front 4wd shaft and braking via that. From memory despite there being no issues selling and using tractors at 50K or more there is no enforcement..... which is another problem entirely. So to say they have no front brakes isn't really right. The more serious reality is if your using brakes rather than gears for downhill speed reduction you want beating...... FYI same with a lorry and I stand by my opinion that testing people in automatic lorrys contributed to the Bath accident.

In Europe, tractors haul loads exceeding that of the legal weight in the UK safely, with turntable/Nil drawbar weight cart type trailers being quite normal. It works because the trailer brakes work and the tractors are almost always correctly ballasted with either wheel weights, or water ballast in the tyres.
Regarding Cleated tyres.... Depends on the PSI run at and widths, but my money would easily be on the fact that a tractor tyre should be pushing near the same surface area as a lorry tyre considering most are the width of a set of dual wheels and feature a much larger radius than a lorry tyre..... the trailer where the braking force should primarily be coming from tend to be HGV spec tyres on trailers (NOT IMPLEMENTS) so there is no difference there.

Local countryside work where neither vehicle is likely to consistently top 30mph.... tbh the tractor has other safety benefits (like being able to drive off the road to unload rather than in the carriageway) more tractive effort when required and the ability to change body types.
It all depends on the attitude and ability to spec the right tool...... But mostly tractors are disadvantaged due to a archaic and badly understood/enforced licensing system.

 

[GazCro]

I fear your comparing apples and oranges.

If you expect any tractor to match a lorry on a southbound run down the A38 your going to be saddened.
However Autumn, on A, B and Unclassified local roads will soon show why a tractor can without doubt be a better tool..... wet leaves and lorry's don't go together and the last mile into a job is normally where the incidents will stack up.


FYI to run a Fastrac properly, as with a Unimog you need to be running a either a Tandem balanced suspended trailer like a lorry would tow, or a dolly trailer. About the only time I've ever seen this done is the water board units which where soon phased out when the tachograph/O license requirement was enforced. Which was a pity as now they use 8 leg hooklifts which do nothing but drag mud onto the road, get stuck and quite often wind up in capers.

Regarding tractors not having front brakes, I can't remember the particular limits, but I believe up to 40K is acceptable to run using the front 4wd shaft and braking via that. From memory despite there being no issues selling and using tractors at 50K or more there is no enforcement..... which is another problem entirely. So to say they have no front brakes isn't really right. The more serious reality is if your using brakes rather than gears for downhill speed reduction you want beating...... FYI same with a lorry and I stand by my opinion that testing people in automatic lorrys contributed to the Bath accident.

In Europe, tractors haul loads exceeding that of the legal weight in the UK safely, with turntable/Nil drawbar weight cart type trailers being quite normal. It works because the trailer brakes work and the tractors are almost always correctly ballasted with either wheel weights, or water ballast in the tyres.
Regarding Cleated tyres.... Depends on the PSI run at and widths, but my money would easily be on the fact that a tractor tyre should be pushing near the same surface area as a lorry tyre considering most are the width of a set of dual wheels and feature a much larger radius than a lorry tyre..... the trailer where the braking force should primarily be coming from tend to be HGV spec tyres on trailers (NOT IMPLEMENTS) so there is no difference there.

Local countryside work where neither vehicle is likely to consistently top 30mph.... tbh the tractor has other safety benefits (like being able to drive off the road to unload rather than in the carriageway) more tractive effort when required and the ability to change body types.
It all depends on the attitude and ability to spec the right tool...... But mostly tractors are disadvantaged due to a archaic and badly understood/enforced licensing system.

A big problem with tractors and more specifically trailers for behind them is actually the trailer manufacturers. It's such a cut throat business and without proper regulation that they all use very misleading wording with regard to axles and braking systems. A lot of trailers out there folk think are the bees knees with commercial axles are merely 10 stud hubs over brake shoes barely bigger than an IW trailer.

 

[JD450A]

A big problem with tractors and more specifically trailers for behind them is actually the trailer manufacturers. It's such a cut throat business and without proper regulation that they all use very misleading wording with regard to axles and braking systems. A lot of trailers out there folk think are the bees knees with commercial axles are merely 10 stud hubs over brake shoes barely bigger than an IW trailer.

Correct.
Likewise very few have correctly set load sensing valves.

 

[GazCro]

I fear your comparing apples and oranges.

If you expect any tractor to match a lorry on a southbound run down the A38 your going to be saddened.
However Autumn, on A, B and Unclassified local roads will soon show why a tractor can without doubt be a better tool..... wet leaves and lorry's don't go together and the last mile into a job is normally where the incidents will stack up.


FYI to run a Fastrac properly, as with a Unimog you need to be running a either a Tandem balanced suspended trailer like a lorry would tow, or a dolly trailer. About the only time I've ever seen this done is the water board units which where soon phased out when the tachograph/O license requirement was enforced. Which was a pity as now they use 8 leg hooklifts which do nothing but drag mud onto the road, get stuck and quite often wind up in capers.

Regarding tractors not having front brakes, I can't remember the particular limits, but I believe up to 40K is acceptable to run using the front 4wd shaft and braking via that. From memory despite there being no issues selling and using tractors at 50K or more there is no enforcement..... which is another problem entirely. So to say they have no front brakes isn't really right. The more serious reality is if your using brakes rather than gears for downhill speed reduction you want beating...... FYI same with a lorry and I stand by my opinion that testing people in automatic lorrys contributed to the Bath accident.

In Europe, tractors haul loads exceeding that of the legal weight in the UK safely, with turntable/Nil drawbar weight cart type trailers being quite normal. It works because the trailer brakes work and the tractors are almost always correctly ballasted with either wheel weights, or water ballast in the tyres.
Regarding Cleated tyres.... Depends on the PSI run at and widths, but my money would easily be on the fact that a tractor tyre should be pushing near the same surface area as a lorry tyre considering most are the width of a set of dual wheels and feature a much larger radius than a lorry tyre..... the trailer where the braking force should primarily be coming from tend to be HGV spec tyres on trailers (NOT IMPLEMENTS) so there is no difference there.

Local countryside work where neither vehicle is likely to consistently top 30mph.... tbh the tractor has other safety benefits (like being able to drive off the road to unload rather than in the carriageway) more tractive effort when required and the ability to change body types.
It all depends on the attitude and ability to spec the right tool...... But mostly tractors are disadvantaged due to a archaic and badly understood/enforced licensing system.

I've always been under the impression that unimogs do not like hitch load yet you see all the mogs getting bought at the minute and getting standard ag style trailers put behind them (most of which far exceed the uk 3 ton hitch load for an ag tractor on the road anyway).

 

[Lancs Lad]

Correct.
Likewise very few have correctly set load sensing valves.

Pulled along a 22 plate fastrac today...my 10 year old "heck that trailer looks knackered"...

 

[JD450A]

I've always been under the impression that unimogs do not like hitch load yet you see all the mogs getting bought at the minute and getting standard ag style trailers put behind them (most of which far exceed the uk 3 ton hitch load for an ag tractor on the road anyway).

Both Fastracs and Unimogs have full suspension. From memory the fastrac is slightly more forgiving than the Mog to receiving a hitch load.
Mogs don't like Hitch loads as I'm sure @Mogman will point out. Hence most have truck type couplers.

 

[GazCro]

Both Fastracs and Unimogs have full suspension. From memory the fastrac is slightly more forgiving than the Mog to receiving a hitch load.
Mogs don't like Hitch loads as I'm sure @Mogman will point out. Hence most have truck type couplers.

I find it amusing that mog dealers delight in showing new customers mogs dragging their arse down the road with about 8 ton on the hitch

 

[Smiffy]

I fear your comparing apples and oranges.

If you expect any tractor to match a lorry on a southbound run down the A38 your going to be saddened.
However Autumn, on A, B and Unclassified local roads will soon show why a tractor can without doubt be a better tool..... wet leaves and lorry's don't go together and the last mile into a job is normally where the incidents will stack up.

That may be the case near you but round here you simply don't get the chance for leaves or mud to build up. Likewise the size of the roads rarely limit the speed a tractor can travel. Therefore you have to compare a tractor running flat out to a lorry doing 40mph. The lorry wins every time.
Tractors don't like turning with trailers they are unstable. The back end of a tractor is rarely heavy enough to control a trailer.
And said the breaking is appauling. This is fine when you are in control of the situation. I'm perfectly capable of driving a tractor safely as are tbh the majority of tractor drivers. The problem is other motorists. When someone overtakes you where they shouldn't as you are slow. Or someone pulls out or makes you swerve. This is what tractors can't handle.
A safe speed to travel on the roads round here is realistically 10mph to account for the idiots. The lorry's can realistically handle the same problems at 3-4 times the speed.
As for driving into the field to unload. That's a fine concept but almost all the fastraks I've seen are running 17.5 in rims with dual tyres. They get stuck at a sideways look at a bit of mud and make incredible mess most of which gets dragged onto the road.

Lorry tyres also definitely grip tarmac better than cleated tyres. Cleated tyres are no good atall on the road. Even at low pressure. But the low pressure is then affecting the handling and stability of the tractor.

 

[Smiffy]

A big problem with tractors and more specifically trailers for behind them is actually the trailer manufacturers. It's such a cut throat business and without proper regulation that they all use very misleading wording with regard to axles and braking systems. A lot of trailers out there folk think are the bees knees with commercial axles are merely 10 stud hubs over brake shoes barely bigger than an IW trailer.

A lot of trailer manufacturers offer hyd breaks and air breaks. But hide the fact you have to spec commercial axles so a lot of people are only running 3in pads thinking they are safe as have air breaks. In reality correctly set up hyd brakes a commercial axle will give superior breaking to air break chambers fitted to agricultural axles

I've always been under the impression that unimogs do not like hitch load yet you see all the mogs getting bought at the minute and getting standard ag style trailers put behind them (most of which far exceed the uk 3 ton hitch load for an ag tractor on the road anyway).

Yes unimogs hang the hitch off the chassis. And a lot of the poor quality aftermarket linkages hand off the chassis too. But the fastraks and correctly setup unimogs hand the hitch off the axle. Also makes them better at ploughing as the tail can't wag the dog

 

[V8Druid]

As for driving into the field to unload. That's a fine concept but ...... make incredible mess most of which gets dragged onto the road.

cleated tyres

the mess left around here by traccies on humongous tyres in/out of fields is horrendous .... anyone else (building site/quarry/whatever) would have the book thrown at them ... some of the roads here are 2-3" deep in sh1t in a matter of hours and's spread for miles as it flies off the cleats as their spotty faced jockeys gun 'em down/up the road

 

[Smiffy]

the mess left around here by traccies on humongous tyres in/out of fields is horrendous .... anyone else (building site/quarry/whatever) would have the book thrown at them ... some of the roads here are 2-3" deep in sh1t in a matter of hours and's spread for miles as it flies off the cleats as their spotty faced jockeys gun 'em down/up the road

They are clamping down on it here. Beginning of the year a young lad on a moped was killed after he fell off due to the mud on the road and hit by two cars unable to stop. Maize and potatoes should all be done with transfer trailers running in the field and unloading into wagons sat In The road. Or a hard standing area like the beet growers use.