Budget and red diesel restrictions

[V8Druid]

Red diesel consultation deadline looming !!

Red diesel consultation deadline looming

If you haven’t yet told Rishi Sunak what you think of his plans to end the tax rebate for red diesel on construction sites, you might want to do so quickly.

www.theconstructionindex.co.uk

 

[V8Druid]

"rishi urged to delay red diesel axe"

Red diesel axe to cost construction up to £490m a year

Civil engineering contractors have joined the plant hire sector in lobbying the chancellor of the exchequer not to cut the rebate on red diesel.

www.theconstructionindex.co.uk

Plant owners warn Treasury that red diesel axe needs seven years to avoid havoc

The Scottish Plant Owners Association has spelled out the Treasury the fault lines in its plan to end the subsidy for red diesel in construction.

www.theconstructionindex.co.uk

 

[Jimoz]

That bloke I met who ran dozens hadn't even heard this was coming. A lot will be in for a shock. Can't see it happening.

 

[Jimoz]

*dozers

 

[Antony Holmes]

this was old girls of plant hire grope

Petition: Continue Red diesel exemption for small plant contractors in rural areas

I would like small providers of plant machinery in rural areas to be allowed to use rebated fuel in there machines so we can remain competitive with farmers and agricultural contractors who will continue to be allowed it. The Industry should be a level playing field and at the moment it is not.

petition.parliament.uk

 

[Left hooker]

this was old girls of plant hire grope

Petition: Continue Red diesel exemption for small plant contractors in rural areas

I would like small providers of plant machinery in rural areas to be allowed to use rebated fuel in there machines so we can remain competitive with farmers and agricultural contractors who will continue to be allowed it. The Industry should be a level playing field and at the moment it is not.

petition.parliament.uk

Rory started it

 

[Furniss]

this was old girls of plant hire grope

Petition: Continue Red diesel exemption for small plant contractors in rural areas

I would like small providers of plant machinery in rural areas to be allowed to use rebated fuel in there machines so we can remain competitive with farmers and agricultural contractors who will continue to be allowed it. The Industry should be a level playing field and at the moment it is not.

petition.parliament.uk

Ultimately it didnt work in France , just bought an extension.

Rory started it

 

[Quattromike]

So if you run a farm business next to your construction business will there be commissioners checking you are using the correct duty fuel in the correct equipment ?

 

[GazCro]

So if you run a farm business next to your construction business will there be commissioners checking you are using the correct duty fuel in the correct equipment ?

You mean like everyone does?

 

[DaveDCB]

So if you run a farm business next to your construction business will there be commissioners checking you are using the correct duty fuel in the correct equipment ?

I’m sure they will try but it will take a very long time and a lot of ‘examples’ made of farmers/contractors to make them stop!

 

[Routy56]

Think that I need to put in another big order for red soon

 

[Left hooker]

It's what's need to be done to change over is lacking in information do you just slap white in same tank and show receipts for white bought

 

[GazCro]

It's what's need to be done to change over is lacking in information do you just slap white in same tank and show receipts for white bought

I've no experience of hmrc dipping tanks but i guess they'll know when they do whether a machine has recently had a decent quantity of red in it or just a v small trace. Let's face it there will be a trace in any tank of a machine which had ran on red for a few years for a long time after you change it over.
They'll likely know what fuel you are buying before they ask as well. I know years ago they used to regularly visit local fuel suppliers and ask to see customer accounts. They would then check through (mainly those buying red and white diesel) and look for irregularities in the amount of each bought (ie suddenly buying a lot of red and no white) and decide where to "randomly" call or who to "randomly" stop.

 

[Gunners]

I have no idea how they are going to police it, is it a police matter? No? Is it Vosa who currently dip tanks on the roads? (only ever had that once in 18 years of driving) I don't think Vosa will care, so its an HMRC issue - do they even have on the ground inspectors? Accountants to check your books yes but they aren't going to be getting their hands dirty.
Who is going to enforce this exactly?
And how? I could come off a job for a farm, 1/4 of a tank left in the digger, then next day be on a construction job. Am I supposed to drain all the red before starting? Or I could be on a live building site but solely doing landscaping which as part of horticulture - is exempt too!

I know how I'm going to do it - sell my bowser and just fill up at the pumps each week when I fill the truck. My price will have to increase to cover this to all customers. But I might be lucky, my machines aren't that thirsty so its a negligible increase for me.
Diesel at £1.30ish round here at the pumps. Remove the VAT and that's £1.08 so around 50p/l more than red. I know that's DOUBLE the cost nearly but equates to £10/day extra for me.... Not really worth worrying about with a mini digger.
You boys with 20 tonners and big tractors though..... better start farming!

 

[TiltyShaun]

Will be changing the farm tank to white to save time going to our local rip off fuel station. Don’t do enough farm work to have the hassle of 2 tanks and will just get the farmer to supply red if on farm. If not…up goes the the rate.

 

[Quattromike]

Then comes the next question, we have 4 forklifts, a tractor and a dock spotter that we're not going to be taking up to the petrol station to fuel up and not messing with drums so does it make sense to get a bunker station in the yard with white derv in and fill all the vans/trucks from here also?
All in it's probably only approx 15000 L a year so not going to get the price that you get at the pumps.

 

[Left hooker]

I have no idea how they are going to police it, is it a police matter? No? Is it Vosa who currently dip tanks on the roads? (only ever had that once in 18 years of driving) I don't think Vosa will care, so its an HMRC issue - do they even have on the ground inspectors? Accountants to check your books yes but they aren't going to be getting their hands dirty.
Who is going to enforce this exactly?
And how? I could come off a job for a farm, 1/4 of a tank left in the digger, then next day be on a construction job. Am I supposed to drain all the red before starting? Or I could be on a live building site but solely doing landscaping which as part of horticulture - is exempt too!

I know how I'm going to do it - sell my bowser and just fill up at the pumps each week when I fill the truck. My price will have to increase to cover this to all customers. But I might be lucky, my machines aren't that thirsty so its a negligible increase for me.
Diesel at £1.30ish round here at the pumps. Remove the VAT and that's £1.08 so around 50p/l more than red. I know that's DOUBLE the cost nearly but equates to £10/day extra for me.... Not really worth worrying about with a mini digger.
You boys with 20 tonners and big tractors though..... better start farming!

Before the renaming to HMRC we had a drop in by customs and excise, they dipped all the trucks and vans looking for trace amounts of red dye

 

[craig]

Before the renaming to HMRC we had a drop in by customs and excise, they dipped all the trucks and vans looking for trace amounts of red dye

I`ve had a unannounced call, and they checked all the vehicles on the yard. (All good btw)

 

[Left hooker]

I`ve had a unannounced call, and they checked all the vehicles on the yard. (All good btw)

Same here got bulk tanks for both so no need

 

[V8Druid]

used to sell both red and white and run both in trucks/cranes/FLTs/etc. C&E were in monthly -- weights and measures quarterly .... when RDCO regs came in HMRC had a staff of 1000+ administering it. Massive amount of paperwork which should in theory diminish to a degree ..... some of those staff'll get re-assigned i'd imagine

as for the changeover question above .... from what I read somewhere a while back ... there will be no 'grace' period .... folks'll be expected to be ready to comply 'on the day'... no using up stocks ... should already have been changed over by 'the day' .... only thing allowed will be whatever is in the machine's tanks as they'll be a nightmare to clean ..... bulk tanks will have to be purged apparently ...... pretty sure I put a link up to this a while back. As for staff ... this'll likely be a big money spinner for HMRC .... they'll staff it and police it, for sure.