Tilty....what is in it for the end user?

[TiltyShaun]

It seems Robs post for a job at Engcon has started quite a conversation about Tilty use and ownership costs.

So I thought we should have a what has a tilty done for you thread!!

 

[TiltyShaun]

Made my life easier. Pick up the shovel a lot less than before. The comment Rory has made about attachments is very valid. U have added quite a few bits to the collection. The ripper....extremely useful to concrete and amazing what roots it can unpick!! I very cheap home made grading beam. It has improved my grading speed and quality by no end. Even my wife is amazed at what I can do with the digger when let lose in the garden.

 

[Mintsauce]

I like the looks on the faces of the non initiated, non believers, infidels.

 

[Regy53]

I am not clued on on new prices of tilts but the resale of machines with them fitted has always amazed me residual wise.

 

[TiltyShaun]

I am not clued on on new prices of tilts but the resale of machines with them fitted has always amazed me residual wise.

I don't expect to sell mine for a while!! But I will also say that as someone who was out of the market for all machines for 5 to 6 years I find all current machine prices eye watering!!

 

[fred]

a small digression regarding machine value, if you are self employed then a well looked after machine will return a good profit. I look as ours as a piece of pension!

 

[fred]

some examples of how my little digger became a mini telehandler.

1. I can lift and place the beams (block and beam) with precision to minimise manual lifting. With our telehandler and forks they could be placed in general location then had to be manually lifted.

2. Anyone can grade perfectly if they can slew. Align the bucket across the area to be graded and slew. That's it. Obviously it can be built on but just by rotating the bucket 90 degrees the need to make 3 or 4 control at the same time (drawing the bucket to you)is negated.

3. Filling. By tiling the bucket 45 degrees you can precision fill barrows, awkward areas, only drop what is needed etc. Most appreciated when concreting.

4. Pallet forks. Material handling, while you may not be able to lift a ton above the digger onto scaff you can certainly lift a good half ton. And with more precision and shunting than a telehandler. Means the ground istn ripped up as fast and one less machine on site.

5. Posts and stumps. While you dont have to have a tilty it's just quicker, more posts per hour etc. Once you have the auger you have a stump planer as well.

6. The grab. My favourite part as its always on and ready to use, from pulling out roots to picking jumbo bags without leaving the cab, from placing kerbs to unrolling mdpe water pipe. I use it loads and couldn't live without it now.

7. Quick hitch. Oh the joy of not having to leave the cab! Where I used to think sod it I'll make it work with a bucket too big/small its now trivial to always use the right one, or none!

8. Finally, the free one - extra reach as your dipper has just got longer.

 

[Hydremaduck]

Tilty....what is in it for the end user?


Sleepless nights,
stress,
worrying have I done the right thing?
is it the right colour?
have I got the correct control system?
how many buckets do I need?
should I buy new buckets?
is a grading beam worth it?
should I keep the 6ft ditcher? just in case!
will others still associate with me if its a different colour?
how much can I charge extra?
will it make me a better person?
will it make me a better operator?
what if I can't get another hire?
what if my customers don't like it?

FFS! why would anybody put themselves through all this heartache?

AND have you seen the price of the bloody things! I can buy another digger for that

AND thats without contemplating the brain fade, dumb moments and shear panic when the brain cannot remember what the fingers are supposed to be doing

 

[CPS]

Tilty....what is in it for the end user?


Sleepless nights,
stress,
worrying have I done the right thing?
is it the right colour?
have I got the correct control system?
how many buckets do I need?
should I buy new buckets?
is a grading beam worth it?
should I keep the 6ft ditcher? just in case!
will others still associate with me if its a different colour?
how much can I charge extra?
will it make me a better person?
will it make me a better operator?
what if I can't get another hire?
what if my customers don't like it?

FFS! why would anybody put themselves through all this heartache?

AND have you seen the price of the bloody things! I can buy another digger for that

AND thats without contemplating the brain fade, dumb moments and shear panic when the brain cannot remember what the fingers are supposed to be doing

SO your the one going for the Engcon ambasiters job....... got ya

 

[Grahams]

I think post number 7 from Fred summed up most of it.
Main thing is time savings and as the saying goes, time is money. One of the standard jobs I do it saves me a night away for two guys every time. Two hotel bills per job soon adds up without the extra work that can be fitted in.
Graham

 

[Antony Holmes]

Most of my jobs to be honest i dont think get done a lot quicker but with a lot less labour no men running around with shovels. so the extra i charge is out weighed 3-4 times over

 

[V8Druid]

from the day I saw Rob Taylor's new toy in june '13, when I joined CEF ....... I wanted one....... could see the potential instantly......
when I eventually acquired the 'Drema close to a year later I REALLY wanted one ...... but could not justify spending more on one, than I had on the machine, to myself.... but I really REALLY wanted one.
so spent many months researching and building my own incarnation, to give me that tilt and rotate potential that I really REALLY had to have.
although of late she's done a lot more of what she was built to do ...... ultimately my 'Drema is more of a handler to me, a lot of the time, so that tilt/twist facility is essential for what I need to be able to do with her.

as has been said many times ..... all over the place ...... no going back, once you've experienced the potential

 

[JD450A]

I have quietly done a bit of tilty driving over the past couple years. I will say in particular that the pinch of salt argument is always prevalent.... "it's so wonderful.... etc".

They are fantastically diverse bits of equipment. Not suited for everyone down to both cost and the fact that they can quite easily reverse productivity/increase on site costs when overused. It's nice to see elsewhere on the forum Robert @Engcon UK actually voicing that second fact which is a refreshing pitch from a salesman!

The key thing I've found with them is the reduction of waste materials, e.g placing pipe bedding or concrete. I've not used forks but as I understand they are also the boys for that and the extra axis they add to a grab is helpful (Although I wouldn't be rushing to buy one solely on that merit). The very obvious one is you can also cut banks directly in line with the machine instead of being at 90' to them.... I would argue any proficient operator can do the same work to a similar standard with a standard bucket trimming steps, those steps also giving the topsoil something to cling to when the bank is dressed ready for seeding, but that work has so many variations and circumstances that it's very easy to get lost in it.

The hourly rate is what prevents me from going down the route at this present time. We have decided instead to focus on bulk earthmoving on a small scale as it's a niche which we have worked ourselves into locally.

Would I have one? If circumstances where slightly different (i.e focused on one machine rather than a fleet),I probably would..... it also would spend 60% minimum of it's life off the machine so we'd have a twin hitch setup.... Loading wagons, digging narrow trenches, Breaker and other "hard" applications do not warrant the unit..... IMHO a lot of "I can't take it off" happens..... take the fkn thing off... Charge a daily rate for having it around/on your machine! Customers will eventually learn.

The Tools/attachments are what brings a tilt rotator from a niche tool into a must have unit IMHO, and the costs in those can easily be the same price as the initial tilty purchase.

Biggest killer for those making the investment will be if the likes of Lunch, Flannel, or similar plant hire decide they could buy 100 units at vast discount and flood the market with cheap self drive units.....

 

[TiltyShaun]

I have quietly done a bit of tilty driving over the past couple years. I will say in particular that the pinch of salt argument is always prevalent.... "it's so wonderful.... etc".

They are fantastically diverse bits of equipment. Not suited for everyone down to both cost and the fact that they can quite easily reverse productivity/increase on site costs when overused. It's nice to see elsewhere on the forum Robert @Engcon UK actually voicing that second fact which is a refreshing pitch from a salesman!

The key thing I've found with them is the reduction of waste materials, e.g placing pipe bedding or concrete. I've not used forks but as I understand they are also the boys for that and the extra axis they add to a grab is helpful (Although I wouldn't be rushing to buy one solely on that merit). The very obvious one is you can also cut banks directly in line with the machine instead of being at 90' to them.... I would argue any proficient operator can do the same work to a similar standard with a standard bucket trimming steps, those steps also giving the topsoil something to cling to when the bank is dressed ready for seeding, but that work has so many variations and circumstances that it's very easy to get lost in it.

The hourly rate is what prevents me from going down the route at this present time. We have decided instead to focus on bulk earthmoving on a small scale as it's a niche which we have worked ourselves into locally.

Would I have one? If circumstances where slightly different (i.e focused on one machine rather than a fleet),I probably would..... it also would spend 60% minimum of it's life off the machine so we'd have a twin hitch setup.... Loading wagons, digging narrow trenches, Breaker and other "hard" applications do not warrant the unit..... IMHO a lot of "I can't take it off" happens..... take the fkn thing off... Charge a daily rate for having it around/on your machine! Customers will eventually learn.

The Tools/attachments are what brings a tilt rotator from a niche tool into a must have unit IMHO, and the costs in those can easily be the same price as the initial tilty purchase.

Biggest killer for those making the investment will be if the likes of Lunch, Flannel, or similar plant hire decide they could buy 100 units at vast discount and flood the market with cheap self drive units.....

I think you talk wise words as usual Rory. My work tends to be everything apart from bulk earth moving!! I have also been adding additional buckets and attachments which make full use of the tilty. I did stop the other day when I was quoted nearly £1200 for a brush attachment which is just a broom head on S30. For that money I can still sweep up myself!!

 

[Jimbo69]

What kind of money is one for an 8-9 tonne machine? A basic set-up with top and bottom hitch, set of buckets and forks?

 

[Hydremaduck]

What kind of money is one for an 8-9 tonne machine? A basic set-up with top and bottom hitch, set of buckets and forks?

Best bet is to pick up the phone and talk to the suppliers direct. Tell them from outset you simply want a ball park figure.

 

[Engcon UK]

What kind of money is one for an 8-9 tonne machine? A basic set-up with top and bottom hitch, set of buckets and forks?

As Rob says above - talk direct. The three main companies in the UK (in the world, for that matter) are us (Engcon), Rototilt and Steelwrist.

Call all of us and ask the question. Engcon's landline is 01684 297168 or if you would like to talk to me direct, please call 07702 167809

regards

Robert

 

[Antony Holmes]

I think you talk wise words as usual Rory. My work tends to be everything apart from bulk earth moving!! I have also been adding additional buckets and attachments which make full use of the tilty. I did stop the other day when I was quoted nearly £1200 for a brush attachment which is just a broom head on S30. For that money I can still sweep up myself!!

i made mine up. link below for brush it has gone up a bit since i made mine but very high quality brush and brilliant for cleaning up sand ect from grass cost me about £850.00

https://www.sweepertec.com/store/p1/Sweepertec_2000_Assembly.html?gclid=Cj0KCQjwxvbdBR

 

[TiltyShaun]

i made mine up. link below for brush it has gone up a bit since i made mine but very high quality brush and brilliant for cleaning up sand ect from grass cost me about £850.00
View attachment 2250
View attachment 2251
https://www.sweepertec.com/store/p1/Sweepertec_2000_Assembly.html?gclid=Cj0KCQjwxvbdBR

Thank you for that. I still think that is rather overpriced or am I just out of touch on the price of a BRUSH!

 

[fred]

In fairness the same could be said of a shovel.

It boils down to volume, if you have to brush an acre of grass then you will need a few of you and a couple days or a machine and half a day.