JD450A
Feral as Fk 🐾
But that is why most small buisnesses under (5 i believe) staff are exempt from much of it.
Storrsy
Well-known member
I did my NPORS ticket. I guess it's expired but don't think I've ever been asked specifically for it. Funny when they came to yard to test me I managed to pull up a dead sheep and an old drain installed by conscientious objectors- felt quite proud of my achievements tbh
S
Smiffy
Well-known member
As far as I am aware, their is very little, in the grand scheme of things, that have an exemption.
V8Druid
do it as well as you can,but learn to do it better
SME,s with 5 or less staff are exempt from quite a lot of things - or always used to be, anyway
... can't recall what exactly - been out of it a long time, but was the case 
hiluxman
Well-known member
I think that's still the case.SME,s with 5 or less staff are exempt from quite a lot of things - or always used to be, anyway
I think over 5 employees you need written safety statements/policy ect. But less than 5 it can just be a verbal chat about it ect.
S
Smiffy
Well-known member
SME,s with 5 or less staff are exempt from quite a lot of things - or always used to be, anyway
Yes there are exemptions, but what I'm getting at is the amount of stuff that is non negotiable makes the exempt stuff pale into insignificance.
Gunners
Well-known member
Yes, you don't have to have written risk assessments and method statements. But that does not mean that you are exempt from the law. And to be honest, without something written down, good luck to you defending yourself in court.
I chatted with Rory today about this. It turns out he has paid NOCN the money to do his renewal but refuses to sit through the 30 min bullpoo videos. We all know its rubbish, we all know it counts for nothing. But it is the rules of the game for which we play within. Personally I would just suffer it having paid the money and renew my cards, especially as both he and I are far from retirement at this stage in our careers. These tickets will only get harder to obtain - much easier to keep what you have. I believe Mr Taylor has reiterated this in LinkedIn to you too Rory. He's not wrong.
Sadly my signal (for once) was worse than Rory's and he had a taste of his own medicine trying to talk to a robot and I failed to convince him that its worth keeping his cards.
I wish you the best of luck Rory, and know you no doubt have the skills to forge your own path with or without a card to back you up. Its only in the event something goes wrong that you will really know if you needed them or not. Lawyers are not forgiving and make good money running people like you and I into the ground.
If you truly want to change the system then I suggest we have a big black tie dinner like the CPA had recently (no doubt at the members expense) where we all congratulate each other on how well we have done, fail to decide on any changes but agree to do it all again next year. Maybe that's actually the true PlantTalk christmad party
(paid for by Druids excessive use of G*** paint and CE****)
hiluxman
Well-known member
Exempt from law is one thing I did not say.Yes, you don't have to have written risk assessments and method statements. But that does not mean that you are exempt from the law. And to be honest, without something written down, good luck to you defending yourself in court.
I chatted with Rory today about this. It turns out he has paid NOCN the money to do his renewal but refuses to sit through the 30 min bullpoo videos. We all know its rubbish, we all know it counts for nothing. But it is the rules of the game for which we play within. Personally I would just suffer it having paid the money and renew my cards, especially as both he and I are far from retirement at this stage in our careers. These tickets will only get harder to obtain - much easier to keep what you have. I believe Mr Taylor has reiterated this in LinkedIn to you too Rory. He's not wrong.
Sadly my signal (for once) was worse than Rory's and he had a taste of his own medicine trying to talk to a robot and I failed to convince him that its worth keeping his cards.
I wish you the best of luck Rory, and know you no doubt have the skills to forge your own path with or without a card to back you up. Its only in the event something goes wrong that you will really know if you needed them or not. Lawyers are not forgiving and make good money running people like you and I into the ground.
If you truly want to change the system then I suggest we have a big black tie dinner like the CPA had recently (no doubt at the members expense) where we all congratulate each other on how well we have done, fail to decide on any changes but agree to do it all again next year. Maybe that's actually the true PlantTalk christmad party
6
6feetdown
Well-known member
Yep maybe a series of 1 day absence from the big sites to force their hand on the bsYes, you don't have to have written risk assessments and method statements. But that does not mean that you are exempt from the law. And to be honest, without something written down, good luck to you defending yourself in court.
I chatted with Rory today about this. It turns out he has paid NOCN the money to do his renewal but refuses to sit through the 30 min bullpoo videos. We all know its rubbish, we all know it counts for nothing. But it is the rules of the game for which we play within. Personally I would just suffer it having paid the money and renew my cards, especially as both he and I are far from retirement at this stage in our careers. These tickets will only get harder to obtain - much easier to keep what you have. I believe Mr Taylor has reiterated this in LinkedIn to you too Rory. He's not wrong.
Sadly my signal (for once) was worse than Rory's and he had a taste of his own medicine trying to talk to a robot and I failed to convince him that its worth keeping his cards.
I wish you the best of luck Rory, and know you no doubt have the skills to forge your own path with or without a card to back you up. Its only in the event something goes wrong that you will really know if you needed them or not. Lawyers are not forgiving and make good money running people like you and I into the ground.
If you truly want to change the system then I suggest we have a big black tie dinner like the CPA had recently (no doubt at the members expense) where we all congratulate each other on how well we have done, fail to decide on any changes but agree to do it all again next year. Maybe that's actually the true PlantTalk christmad party
JD450A
Feral as Fk 🐾
I disagree that it'll become harder to get your tickets.... ATM they are handing them to every convict and unemployed urchin that turns up under duress for a bootcamp after there universal credit caseworker has told them it's that or no free money.
I hold a NVQ in multiple types of work, from Excavation, Erecting cranes/rigs and Transport/Lifting Personal opinion is that should hold more weight than CPCS in court than a bit of plastic to the Ponzi scheme, especially considering CPCS themselves utilise the NVQ as there bar/competence indicator.
I'll be really blunt, whilst I love what I do, I am completely at end to the industry and no longer love it or wish to see it improve.... stuff like these tickets are the reason why, people have stockholm syndrome and are content to suggest NOCN and the like are "trying" despite this all being a problem for at least 15 years.
I hold a NVQ in multiple types of work, from Excavation, Erecting cranes/rigs and Transport/Lifting Personal opinion is that should hold more weight than CPCS in court than a bit of plastic to the Ponzi scheme, especially considering CPCS themselves utilise the NVQ as there bar/competence indicator.
I'll be really blunt, whilst I love what I do, I am completely at end to the industry and no longer love it or wish to see it improve.... stuff like these tickets are the reason why, people have stockholm syndrome and are content to suggest NOCN and the like are "trying" despite this all being a problem for at least 15 years.
Bri963
Well-known member
64, still love operating and taking a few hours every five years to renew a bit of plastic doesn’t change that one bit. No doubt CPCS doesn’t contribute anything to safety, and never did, but the pay packets it’s opened up far outweigh any other consideration. Every Chancer may have a card, but chancers don’t hold down the good jobs.
Storrsy
Well-known member
Wise words!
S
Smiffy
Well-known member
But at the end of the day you and most the people on here are not what the ticket system is there for.
It's so that house bashing sites have a chance of absolving themselves from the accidents caused when you turn a construction site into an assembly line.
We can all come up with ideas to improve the system but at the end of the day the system works for what it was designed for. And it's us that are expecting the system to do things is wasn't meant for.
I personally would love legislation to be put in place to dispand large companies for everything bar management and have everyone properly self employed owning their own plant and tools and being properly in control of themselves. This I think could have the possibility to not only raise standards but also to provide a better chance for all individuals to earn better money without job costs increasing.
Bri963
Well-known member
You might need to think this one through if you think it would stop people taking short cuts on the work or undercutting each other on price.
JD450A
Feral as Fk 🐾
Personal opinion is we should be legislating false self employment, umbrella style and the transient worker+ rent a wreck model out of construction and instead either enforcing a full time employee and hired machine or owner operator model....
6
6feetdown
Well-known member
Maybe by not strangling both employees and employer that may happen. But if anything sounds like it's going to drive people even more underground
S
Smiffy
Well-known member
It won't stop short cuts but you would hope it would lead to a little bit more care and less upside down machines.
D
DaveDCB
Well-known member
Simply put , working for others and need to tick a box then keep your tickets in place.. I myself am the end of the line, book stops with me.. so I don’t need a ticket to prove to myself that I can drive almost anything.
Prior I spent over 10 years on all variations of sites and I can think of maybe 20 times my card number was logged on induction paperwork etc, I’d be surprised if it got verified more than once! Real site foremen know within seconds if you can drive a machine safely or not..
Eg was in hospital while ago, 6ton machine working on some footpath replacements outside main entrance, fella was ripping them out and tipping the spoil at full height onto a pile next to him.. Literally chunks of tarmac flying everywhere! My 5yr old can drive a machine better than he could - no joke!! But he had a ticket I’m sure. Orange / green / purple beacons a-blazing!
Prior I spent over 10 years on all variations of sites and I can think of maybe 20 times my card number was logged on induction paperwork etc, I’d be surprised if it got verified more than once! Real site foremen know within seconds if you can drive a machine safely or not..
Eg was in hospital while ago, 6ton machine working on some footpath replacements outside main entrance, fella was ripping them out and tipping the spoil at full height onto a pile next to him.. Literally chunks of tarmac flying everywhere! My 5yr old can drive a machine better than he could - no joke!! But he had a ticket I’m sure. Orange / green / purple beacons a-blazing!
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