Homemade Tiltrotator - How hard can it be ??

[Will_c]

Having used it a few times now, everything seems to be working well. I still haven't got around to painting it yet!

There are a couple of things I'd like to improve. At the moment the bucket is mounted directly to the tiltrotator, which leaves it sitting tilted back (similar to standard bucket geometry ) . When trying to spread material with the bucket turned sideways, there isn't much curl-back available. That should be easy enough to improve by mounting the bucket pins at more of an angle to increase the curl range.

One slightly annoying feature on the Bobcat is that you can't swap the auxiliary controls between the joysticks from within the cab. On a Kubota, AUX1 and AUX2 can be assigned to either joystick.

I've tried plumbing the tiltrotator so that the rotation is powered from AUX1, and it's noticeably easier to operate and much more responsive. Does anyone have any experience with mapping AUX1 to the left-hand joystick on a Bobcat? It seems like something plenty of tiltrotator users would benefit from, so it's a shame there isn't a simple software option to swap the auxiliary functions.

 

[doobin]

Having used it a few times now, everything seems to be working well. I still haven't got around to painting it yet!

There are a couple of things I'd like to improve. At the moment the bucket is mounted directly to the tiltrotator, which leaves it sitting tilted back (similar to standard bucket geometry ) . When trying to spread material with the bucket turned sideways, there isn't much curl-back available. That should be easy enough to improve by mounting the bucket pins at more of an angle to increase the curl range.

One slightly annoying feature on the Bobcat is that you can't swap the auxiliary controls between the joysticks from within the cab. On a Kubota, AUX1 and AUX2 can be assigned to either joystick.

I've tried plumbing the tiltrotator so that the rotation is powered from AUX1, and it's noticeably easier to operate and much more responsive. Does anyone have any experience with mapping AUX1 to the left-hand joystick on a Bobcat? It seems like something plenty of tiltrotator users would benefit from, so it's a shame there isn't a simple software option to swap the auxiliary functions.
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You could potentially find the two connections and make a harness to join them.

I found it easier just to learn the pattern. Should be easy for you as you’ve never used a grab and rotator?

Grab and rotator need to be the other way around for flow. Now I can switch between the two without a second thought.

 

[Smiffy]

You could potentially find the two connections and make a harness to join them.

I found it easier just to learn the pattern. Should be easy for you as you’ve never used a grab and rotator?

Grab and rotator need to be the other way around for flow. Now I can switch between the two without a second thought.

This may make absolutely no sense to anyone else but whenever I have driven something with a rotating bit. Especially when I learnt to drive two grab lorries with the grabs plumbed in, in opposite ways. If I imagined a bar linked from the top of the roller or lever or joystick to the relevant side of the grab, then it would sink in immediately. If I tried to just remember it any other way then it wouldn't sink in.

 

[doobin]

This may make absolutely no sense to anyone else but whenever I have driven something with a rotating bit. Especially when I learnt to drive two grab lorries with the grabs plumbed in, in opposite ways. If I imagined a bar linked from the top of the roller or lever or joystick to the relevant side of the grab, then it would sink in immediately. If I tried to just remember it any other way then it wouldn't sink in.

I’ve never tried that but that makes a LOT of sense

 

[Will_c]

You could potentially find the two connections and make a harness to join them.

I found it easier just to learn the pattern. Should be easy for you as you’ve never used a grab and rotator?

Grab and rotator need to be the other way around for flow. Now I can switch between the two without a second thought.

I can get used to operating the rotation on the right-hand joystick, but it would be nice to learn it the "proper" way, similar to learning an excavator with the standard ISO control pattern.

It would be great if Bobcat could released a software update allowing users to assign the auxiliary functions to either joystick. They have their "ASAC " system which is a bit limited in function

 

[V8Druid]

assume you're 4 pipe-er ... can you not just swap the plumbing over ???

 

[Smiffy]

I’ve never tried that but that makes a LOT of sense

I don't know why I've always done it with machines. If i imagine there is a physical link between control and the machine I can drive them to an acceptable level long before I have commited the controls to muscle memory. I think it comes from working on tractors where spool levers on the dash resemble no logic as to how the implement moves.

 

[Monkeybusiness]

assume you're 4 pipe-er ... can you not just swap the plumbing over ???

Aux 2 on Bobcats is a much lower flow rate - mine shared the boom offset slice through 1/4 inch hoses. It was the second-worst part of the machine (behind the paint, marginally in front of the dealers)

 

[doobin]

Aux 2 on Bobcats is a much lower flow rate - mine shared the boom offset slice through 1/4 inch hoses. It was the second-worst part of the machine (behind the paint, marginally in front of the dealers)

Boom offset share is how the majority of manufacturers seem to do it. A few such as Yanmar manage full flow. Realistically it's not a limitation for most on such a small machine- a rotation circuit on even a 9 tonner is a much slower flow. I can imagine that you might find it a limitation if using a tilty and switching tilt to aux, but to be fair if that's the problem then you should have paid for a full fat tilty install

The other potential issue (that I had to kick said shitty dealers to understand) is that the left can be in one of three flow settings. If you have the deluxe screen you can change this yourself. If not, then the dealers can change it with laptop. My first one came set presumably to max, the second one was on low (noticeably slower) and I had to badger them to understand that this could be changed.

There is a slight delay on the left too, but in practice you get used to it. Biggest issue I had is learning to use rotate on left for timber grab and on right for tilty. Easiest way for Will would be to located the two plugs and swap them, which may require an extended harness.

Did you sell you E27 in the end? I thought you were keeping it as a second machine?

 

[Monkeybusiness]

Boom offset share is how the majority of manufacturers seem to do it. A few such as Yanmar manage full flow. Realistically it's not a limitation for most on such a small machine- a rotation circuit on even a 9 tonner is a much slower flow. I can imagine that you might find it a limitation if using a tilty and switching tilt to aux, but to be fair if that's the problem then you should have paid for a full fat tilty install

The other potential issue (that I had to kick said shitty dealers to understand) is that the left can be in one of three flow settings. If you have the deluxe screen you can change this yourself. If not, then the dealers can change it with laptop. My first one came set presumably to max, the second one was on low (noticeably slower) and I had to badger them to understand that this could be changed.

There is a slight delay on the left too, but in practice you get used to it. Biggest issue I had is learning to use rotate on left for timber grab and on right for tilty. Easiest way for Will would be to located the two plugs and swap them, which may require an extended harness.

Did you sell you E27 in the end? I thought you were keeping it as a second machine?

Sold it in the end.

 

[V8Druid]

Boom offset share is how the majority of manufacturers seem to do it. A few such as Yanmar manage full flow. Realistically it's not a limitation for most on such a small machine- a rotation circuit on even a 9 tonner is a much slower flow. I can imagine that you might find it a limitation if using a tilty and switching tilt to aux, but to be fair if that's the problem then you should have paid for a full fat tilty install

The other potential issue (that I had to kick said shitty dealers to understand) is that the left can be in one of three flow settings. If you have the deluxe screen you can change this yourself. If not, then the dealers can change it with laptop. My first one came set presumably to max, the second one was on low (noticeably slower) and I had to badger them to understand that this could be changed.

There is a slight delay on the left too, but in practice you get used to it. Biggest issue I had is learning to use rotate on left for timber grab and on right for tilty. Easiest way for Will would be to located the two plugs and swap them, which may require an extended harness.

Did you sell you E27 in the end? I thought you were keeping it as a second machine?

left for rotate is std tilty set up

 

[doobin]

left for rotate is std tilty set up

I knwo but the issue is the Bobcat doesnt facilitate this as a four pipe setup- so I learnt both ways!

If I ever fit a tilty to the JCB 86c I'll have the same issue, left is a much slower flow. Wouldnt be an issue for most as they'd swap the connections and forget about it, but running a timber grab and rotator as much as I do the tilty I need to be able to handle both patterns.

It was easier to learn than to fit a changeover switch to two or three machines, thats for sure. E19 has the same.

 

[V8Druid]

Aux 2 on Bobcats is a much lower flow rate - mine shared the boom offset slice through 1/4 inch hoses. It was the second-worst part of the machine (behind the paint, marginally in front of the dealers)

why such small hoses ?? or is the offset fed by 1/4" ??

 

[Will_c]

Had a slight repair to make on the rotation drive for the tiltrotator.
I was a bit short on time while trying to get everything finished for my university report, so I never got around to machining a keyway and fitting a feather key to the shaft driving the worm gearbox. After swapping the hydraulic lines over to increase the rotation speed, the taper-lock bush was relying solely on its clamping force. Eventually it started to slip on the shaft, resulting in a loss of drive.

It was a fairly straightforward fix. I have replaced the taper-lock bush which had worn and machined a keyway into the shaft. The taper-lock already had a 6 mm keyway, but I couldn't find a suitable feather key, so I used an old HSS lathe tool as the stock material. Over to the mill to cut to size and I now have matching keyway to suit the shaft.

 

[doobin]

why such small hoses ?? or is the offset fed by 1/4" ??

On the e27, aux 1 gives up to 55 litres a minute and aux 2 up to 20.

 

[Monkeybusiness]

why such small hoses ?? or is the offset fed by 1/4" ??

Yeah, all fed through drinking straws

 

[Will_c]

On the e27, aux 1 gives up to 55 litres a minute and aux 2 up to 20.

Thinking a little more on this issue it would be nice to have a switch in the cab to swap the roller functions over . This could be done by building plug‑between adapter harnesses at each joystick with a single DPDT switch that crosses the two signal wires. Flip one way and it's stock (right→Aux 1, left→Aux2) . flip the other and the functions trade joysticks (left→Aux 1, right→Aux2). The +5V and ground stay wired straight through and are never switched.

 

[doobin]

Thinking a little more on this issue it would be nice to have a switch in the cab to swap the roller functions over . This could be done by building plug‑between adapter harnesses at each joystick with a single DPDT switch that crosses the two signal wires. Flip one way and it's stock (right→Aux 1, left→Aux2) . flip the other and the functions trade joysticks (left→Aux 1, right→Aux2). The +5V and ground stay wired straight through and are never switched.

I started off thinking along those lines but I was fairly sure I’d f**k it up and blow something up.

So I learnt the pattern.


You’ll be fine though!

 

[doobin]

Yeah, all fed through drinking straws

I don’t know why you’re bitching about it so much, a rotation circuit is almost always a lower flow than the pecker aux, across all brands. It’s not a quirk or fault specific to Bobcat.

That’s why tiltrotator control systems were developed.