25mm mdpe yellow gas pipe to 22mm copper

[V8Druid]

Different things apply to different people. We did some trenching for new gas supplies to 3 static caravans but the actual pipework was carried out by someone with a gno qualification rather than gas safe. I don't know where the boundary is between gno and gas safe.

yet another 'grey area' ... if Vin does the work himself to the required std., 'cos he's not in 'the club', he has to get some one who is, to sign off on it, to say it is up to the required std and get charged through the nose for that ('cos they're getting stung annually too) ... all of this accreditation should be free for those 'that can' - i.e. work to the std. and anyone failing should be stung for failing to meet the std. ... the current system is wholly wrong/arse about face and were it, as suggested, I am sure there would be a huge uplift in quality of work / reduction in costs. If safety is at the forefront of 'concern', this is the way it should be.

 

[pettsy]

I can’t speak for LPG as I don’t have that “element”, I have ACS domestic natural gas (upto 2” pipe and upto a certain installation volume). Underground service pipework is covered by different qualifications not covered by gas safe iirc. Gas safe I would say generally covers working downstream from the Meter (NG).

I have to pay to be registered, £222 a year. Every 5 years I have to be reassessed for every element I have. Yes it’s a “money making scheme” that doesn’t do enough to catch unregistered installers, but I don’t think they have the staff numbers to fully police it!
I would never sign off someone else’s work (in theory the registration rules don’t allow it) but it happens.

 

[V8Druid]

I can’t speak for LPG as I don’t have that “element”, I have ACS domestic natural gas (upto 2” pipe and upto a certain installation volume). Underground service pipework is covered by different qualifications not covered by gas safe iirc. Gas safe I would say generally covers working downstream from the Meter (NG).

I have to pay to be registered, £222 a year. Every 5 years I have to be reassessed for every element I have. Yes it’s a “money making scheme” that doesn’t do enough to catch unregistered installers, but I don’t think they have the staff numbers to fully police it!
I would never sign off someone else’s work (in theory the registration rules don’t allow it) but it happens.

early 2000s when LPG vehicle conversions were 'at their height' in the UK the 'governing std' was L.P.G.A., C.O.P.2 ... but totally 'unpoliced' ...
I used to do my own vehicles and a few for family, but not on any commercial basis.
Adhered rigidly to the C.O.P.2 paperwork, which I'd read, cover to cover, plus much other research on the matter.
I worked carefully & thoroughly, whilst doing an installation, bought only the best components and never had a problem.

As an LPG retailer, I used to get to see dozens of so called 'professional' installations, carried out on a commercial basis and many were horrendous, failing to meet many of the most basic C.O.P.2 requirements and some were downright bloody dangerous.
Literally any Tom, Dick or Harry, could set themselves up as being a 'qualified' installer

Was a guy in Aber doing 'em commercially and I know of three that he 'blew up' and the fourth that finished him, when he burnt his premises to the ground, with the vehicle still inside (the cause of the fire).
Talking with him once, he'd never even heard of the C.O.P.2 or LPG Association.

 

[Vinpetrol]

I'd have to dig them out. Mix of British standards and building regs part J?? I am oddly always crap at recalling reg sources.

For a gas or LPG hob on an kitchen island you would use a wrapped copper pipe (or track pipe) in the installation or screed layer (NOT in the slab) and joint above floor or externally. You 100% do not bring HDPE up through the slab.

That’s good to know. What is a track pipe ?just out of curiosity , What is the issue with it coming through the slab in a duct ?

 

[V8Druid]

I'd have to dig them out. Mix of British standards and building regs part J?? I am oddly always crap at recalling reg sources.

For a gas or LPG hob on an kitchen island you would use a wrapped copper pipe (or track pipe) in the installation or screed layer (NOT in the slab) and joint above floor or externally. You 100% do not bring HDPE up through the slab.

presumably Denso tape wrapped?

 

[Stroppymonkey]

Different things apply to different people. We did some trenching for new gas supplies to 3 static caravans but the actual pipework was carried out by someone with a gno qualification rather than gas safe. I don't know where the boundary is between

just been googling who's responsible for all this crud and actually getting to the root of who's responsible is not easy .. did find this but does not say what 'laws' govern this
https://www.gov.uk/find-licences/registration-to-carry-out-gas-work
yet another money making scheme
whilst I appreciate that combustible gas of any kind can be seriously dangerous, in the wrong/uninformed/untrained hands and I am not knocking some form of accreditation for those dealing with it, it certainly smacks of 'creaming' the industry yet again.
Gas Safe Register appears much like the card schemes and privately run from PO Box 6804, Basingstoke, Hampshire, RG24 4NB .. if you don't pay to 'be in the club' - even though you may be even more proficient than those that do you'm buggered

It’s not the gas that’s dangerous it’s the safe COMBUSTION thats the issue. Very easy to get incomplete combustion in an open flue or flueless appliance, and doesn’t take much to f**k you up/kill you/cause brain damage quite quickly. Similar competent persons schemes exist for oil and solid fuel, although there is a choice of notification bodies which there isn’t for gas. Gas being THE most common fuel burnt in the UK makes it more important I guess. Back when I did my solid fuel training I was told that CO from coal kills more people than gas, but that’s probably changed a bit since then.
Interestingly Gas Safe doesn’t cover sea going vessels or motor vehicles (or forklifts!)

 

[pettsy]

For a gas or LPG hob on an kitchen island you would use a wrapped copper pipe (or track pipe) in the installation or screed layer (NOT in the slab) and joint above floor or externally.

Personally I’d run a duct from underneath a cupboard to the island, personal choice but I’m not a fan of burying pipes. You can also then use it for cable feeds etc.

 

[Stroppymonkey]

Personally I’d run a duct from underneath a cupboard to the island, personal choice but I’m not a fan of burying pipes. You can also then use it for cable feeds etc.

Isn’t a LPG pipe in an unventilated duct a bit iffy on regs though ?

 

[6feetdown]

Client on last job wanted lpg in cavity was a big non no

 

[V8Druid]

Isn’t a LPG pipe in an unventilated duct a bit iffy on regs though ?

would think so as LPG is heavier than air and will pool if captured, like in a duct

 

[V8Druid]

would think so as LPG is heavier than air and will pool if captured, like in a duct

or a van

or a car

 

[pettsy]

Isn’t a LPG pipe in an unventilated duct a bit iffy on regs though ?

Depends how big the duct is. Bs6891, I don’t do LPG so don’t know anything specific to that

Client on last job wanted lpg in cavity was a big non no

Can’t run any gas pipework in cavity

 

[Vinpetrol]

Ok . While I have some gas plumbers attention . Can you advise what I need to be doing for my new build . I’m having an LPG gas hob in the kitchen . It’s the only gas appliance in the building . Heating will be a ground source heat pump.
The hob is on an external wall but I can’t put the gas bottles outside the wall where the hob is . I need to put the bottles outside the wall on the other side of the kitchen . Can I run the gas in a 22mm copper pipe around the service zone in the wall to the other side of the kitchen then go out through the wall ?
It will be a gas safe plumber that does this by the way , it would be good to know my options though .

 

[Lancs Lad]

Ok . While I have some gas plumbers attention . Can you advise what I need to be doing for my new build . I’m having an LPG gas hob in the kitchen . It’s the only gas appliance in the building . Heating will be a ground source heat pump.
The hob is on an external wall but I can’t put the gas bottles outside the wall where the hob is . I need to put the bottles outside the wall on the other side of the kitchen . Can I run the gas in a 22mm copper pipe around the service zone in the wall to the other side of the kitchen then go out through the wall ?
It will be a gas safe plumber that does this by the way , it would be good to know my options though .

Induction hob save all the hassle

 

[V8Druid]

Ok . While I have some gas plumbers attention . Can you advise what I need to be doing for my new build . I’m having an LPG gas hob in the kitchen . It’s the only gas appliance in the building . Heating will be a ground source heat pump.
The hob is on an external wall but I can’t put the gas bottles outside the wall where the hob is . I need to put the bottles outside the wall on the other side of the kitchen . Can I run the gas in a 22mm copper pipe around the service zone in the wall to the other side of the kitchen then go out through the wall ?
It will be a gas safe plumber that does this by the way , it would be good to know my options though .

bore hole or field

 

[V8Druid]

Induction hob save all the hassle

but he'll have to go buy a load of new saucepans .. totally agree though ... but not seen an induction oven yet
Pam loves our induction rings - virtually instant heat
Buy the missus one of these to give it a try @Vinpetrol

https://www.amazon.co.uk/VonShef-Induction-Portable-Ceramic-Electric/dp/B0725FT8L8/ref=asc_df_B0725FT8L8?tag=bingshoppinga-21&linkCode=df0&hvadid=80470564181870&hvnetw=o&hvqmt=e&hvbmt=be&hvdev=c&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=&hvtargid=pla-4584070140928935&psc=1

we've had one a while, as a standby/back up, for our cantankerous Stoves cooker (now replaced after 15 yrs service) .... and it is excellent

 

[pettsy]

Can run the pipework internally around the wall no problem. Where it passes through the cavity wall to outside it should be sleeved, ideally in copper. The distance and amount of fittings used on the run will decide the pipe size required.

 

[Vinpetrol]

Induction hob save all the hassle

might end up that way yet !

 

[Vinpetrol]

bore hole or field

Field .i have the space and the plant so it makes sense

 

[DaveDCB]

might end up that way yet !

Do it, sod buggering around with gas!

Neff are the best from my experience(and normally come with a set of decent pans) , and we always have them on a full RCBO board as the earth leakage is quite high, so combined on a standard RCB only board causes them to trip out.