what you think of this then?

[V8Druid]

2 or 3 times a week, trucks loaded with water from a local bottling factory almost always fail to make this hill into the village. A manual fails to pull off at the T junction ... I have suggested an escort/banksman to ensure a clear run without stopping, which this one appears to have ... but apparently an auto today and didn't even make it to the T junction another 2-300 yds up the hill.
I've never driven an auto truck so have no idea of their potential to pull in these circumstances, but would assume that it should be able to make it further up a hill than this??? a manual can! doesn't seem able to make a run at it today. I am of course assuming he's not overloaded.
Comments gentlemen?

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=724917555886342

 

[Smiffy]

I doubt the gearbox has a lot to do with it. Poor weight distribution, not knowing where the weight transfer button is, tyre choice all have a part to play. The only thing the gearbox could do is change gear at a vital point but this is easily overridden.

 

[V8Druid]

I doubt the gearbox has a lot to do with it. Poor weight distribution, not knowing where the weight transfer button is, tyre choice all have a part to play. The only thing the gearbox could do is change gear at a vital point but this is easily overridden.

ignore the inane 'skid row' comment ..... he just ran out of steam. had no run up at that at all - welly to the floor in too low a gear way too early and no momentum to carry him up .... I've been up that hill in 45t of Grove (with a body stopping traffic at the junction for a free run out of it) gotta hit that hard - not crawling
I assumed that an auto can be driven manually too

 

[Mogman]

ignore the inane 'skid row' comment ..... he just ran out of steam. had no run up at that at all - welly to the floor in too low a gear way too early and no momentum to carry him up .... I've been up that hill in 45t of Grove (with a body stopping traffic at the junction for a free run out of it) gotta hit that hard - not crawling
I assumed that an auto can be driven manually too

A lorry ‘auto’ box is a normal gear box with a proper dry clutch it just has a computer to tell it to change gear and to lt the clutch out

on my lorry it uses the weight on the drive axle sensor to choose a nice gear to pull off in but it can get caught out when I pull out of my yard and have a lot of weight over the trailer axles and not the drive it thinks it’s not got much weight on, so puts it into 4th then as I turn all three trailer axles start to scrub and it ‘dips the clutch’ and stops dead has a think about it and still selects 4th gear again (because it thinks we’re running light) and will fook about confusing itself until you manually select 2nd and it’s away

so on that hill can’t see why they can’t get up

you said your 45ton grove got up there so im sure that lorry (even if it is a Merc) at 44 tonnes with at least one and a half times as much power as you would of had

my lorry when pulling proper heavy up hill I dump the air out of the tag and because the 5th wheel is between the drive and tag axle it lifts the front axle off the ground (well one wheel anyway) but keeps pulling

 

[Brendan]

Did it get up afterwards?
Not idea on how to sort but always a good shout for more bhp and torque

 

[V8Druid]

A lorry ‘auto’ box is a normal gear box with a proper dry clutch it just has a computer to tell it to change gear and to lt the clutch out
on my lorry it uses the weight on the drive axle sensor to choose a nice gear to pull off in but it can get caught out when I pull out of my yard and have a lot of weight over the trailer axles and not the drive it thinks it’s not got much weight on, so puts it into 4th then as I turn all three trailer axles start to scrub and it ‘dips the clutch’ and stops dead has a think about it and still selects 4th gear again (because it thinks we’re running light) and will fook about confusing itself until you manually select 2nd and it’s away
so on that hill can’t see why they can’t get up
you said your 45ton grove got up there so im sure that lorry (even if it is a Merc) at 44 tonnes with at least one and a half times as much power as you would of had
my lorry when pulling proper heavy up hill I dump the air out of the tag and because the 5th wheel is between the drive and tag axle it lifts the front axle off the ground (well one wheel anyway) but keeps pulling

cheers Mog ...
my thoughts exactly ...
the Grove had a 240 Cummins in it, a 13sp Roadranger and a very practised druid, cog swapping.

thanks for the explanation of the commercial 'auto' box .....

basically he hadn't a clue ...
the manuals get up OK, but fail to get away at the T junction if they have to stop and have to 'go again' .....

water place needs to provide 'em with an escort ...
there is a.n.other route, but has a 14ft bridge restriction and since they've been collecting in artic.s rather than the original rigids, it's been a fiasco.
The road is totally unsuitable

 

[Quattromike]

So it doesn't spin out the wheels it's actually pulling up and deciding not to carry on? Surely even an auto would select a lower gear and keep rugging. Our old DAF is auto and on a hill you can hold the hand brake on and start wellying it until she feels like the she has full control and ease off the brake and away she chuggs.

 

[Bob]

I was following Wyatts Scaina with D8 and ripper out of lee moor I was on a Cat 631 following, as he got half way up the hill he missed his gear and stopped but brakes could not hold it .It started to run back I lifted box as high as it would go which bought front down and it hit the winch on the low loader I then put foot down and shot him up the hill when we got to Plymouth the police escort came and see me and said can you tel the low loader driver to select low gear at bottom hill like all local drivers do not f king half way up. that was many lorry stories I witnessed

 

[V8Druid]

I was following Wyatts Scaina with D8 and ripper out of lee moor I was on a Cat 631 following, as he got half way up the hill he missed his gear and stopped but brakes could not hold it .It started to run back I lifted box as high as it would go which bought front down and it hit the winch on the low loader I then put foot down and shot him up the hill when we got to Plymouth the police escort came and see me and said can you tel the low loader driver to select low gear at bottom hill like all local drivers do not f king half way up. that was many lorry stories I witnessed

assume that would've been the old road up to Plympton? ... hell of a pull

 

[Smiffy]

So it doesn't spin out the wheels it's actually pulling up and deciding not to carry on? Surely even an auto would select a lower gear and keep rugging. Our old DAF is auto and on a hill you can hold the hand brake on and start wellying it until she feels like the she has full control and ease off the brake and away she chuggs.

Every one I've driven is prone to stuttering and getting the wrong gear when on hills Or changing gear at precisely the wrong moment. Although some are better than others. Noone I have spoken to likes the man auto box. But the volvos are as close as you can get to a manual but honestly can't feel the gear change atall

 

[V8Druid]

Did it get up afterwards?
Not idea on how to sort but always a good shout for more bhp and torque

went back to whence it came ('bout 5 miles back) and offed a third of the load apparently .... TBH it makes me wonder just how much they put on these artic.s ... water is nigh on a kilo a litre .. 's not exactly a light load, for it's bulk

 

[Smiffy]

went back to whence it came ('bout 5 miles back) and offed a third of the load apparently .... TBH it makes me wonder just how much they put on these artic.s ... water is nigh on a kilo a litre .. 's not exactly a light load, for it's bulk

Also depends where they put it. Some arctic drivers will double stack over the 5th wheel and leave the back of the trailer empty to give better traction.

 

[V8Druid]

IMHDO ..... he just did not have enough momentum, due to not getting sufficient speed up lower down - in the wrong cog - end of

 

[pettsy]

I’m no hgv driver, but that doesn’t look right to me. Looked more like the driver gave up than it stopped pulling. Surely it would/should kick down to a lower gear?

 

[LKSF]

the manuals get up OK, but fail to get away at the T junction if they have to stop and have to 'go again' .....

What is the D for here? IMHDO? Deluded? Druid?

The problem is (and with the whole debate maybe) is that probably you don't know if they're in Auto or Manual?
What do you mean by 'fail to get away' exactly? Lack of traction? Again, if it's got traction, but bogging down we don't know what mode the box is in. You need to go have a chat with chap by the side of the road.
We need answers now and you're the man to get them God dammit!

It's an odd one, because A. They've been trained to do the job and B. I can't see someone producing a truck which can't do its job.
I could ask the FIL as he used to be a truck driver and I think still keeps in with that crowd, but he'll maybe ask the same questions. It's mind blowing how many gears these things have.

 

[Smiffy]

What is the D for here? IMHDO? Deluded? Druid?

The problem is (and with the whole debate maybe) is that probably you don't know if they're in Auto or Manual?
What do you mean by 'fail to get away' exactly? Lack of traction? Again, if it's got traction, but bogging down we don't know what mode the box is in. You need to go have a chat with chap by the side of the road.
We need answers now and you're the man to get them God dammit!

It's an odd one, because A. They've been trained to do the job and B. I can't see someone producing a truck which can't do its job.
I could ask the FIL as he used to be a truck driver and I think still keeps in with that crowd, but he'll maybe ask the same questions. It's mind blowing how many gears these things have.

Honestly the training given to lorry drivers is the bare minimum to pass a test. Then the cpc is just a tick box excercise. The load distribution section is pathetic and I've never been in one that mentions the weight transfer button, difflocks appropriate times to use the manual option. Infact the manual option is frowned upon as being uneconomical.
Then you have the fact that most arctic drivers go from one distribution center specifically designed for lorries, down a motorway to another distribution center specifically designed for lorries. You do get good drivers but you will rarely find them on standard haulage jobs. And standard haulage jobs will rarely create good drivers.

 

[LKSF]

Honestly the training given to lorry drivers is the bare minimum to pass a test. Then the cpc is just a tick box excercise. The load distribution section is pathetic and I've never been in one that mentions the weight transfer button, difflocks appropriate times to use the manual option. Infact the manual option is frowned upon as being uneconomical.
Then you have the fact that most arctic drivers go from one distribution center specifically designed for lorries, down a motorway to another distribution center specifically designed for lorries. You do get good drivers but you will rarely find them on standard haulage jobs. And standard haulage jobs will rarely create good drivers.

Basically 'Operator error' then? Wow, thanks for the explanation

Did you ever watch that late night series (I forget the name) where they followed the very large recovery trucks as they went about their work? That was pretty good.

 

[V8Druid]

What do you mean by 'fail to get away' exactly? Lack of traction? Again, if it's got traction, but bogging down we don't know what mode the box is in. You need to go have a chat with chap by the side of the road.
We need answers now and you're the man to get them God dammit!

It's an odd one, because A. They've been trained to do the job and B. I can't see someone producing a truck which can't do its job.
I could ask the FIL as he used to be a truck driver and I think still keeps in with that crowd, but he'll maybe ask the same questions. It's mind blowing how many gears these things have.

it's one hell of a pull off Boyo, steep and 90 left, or right preferably ... depends on what's parked where -- locals have no idea and park either side of the junction and dead opposite it ... needs double yellowing, but they'd still ignore them. From a dead halt it's a half shaft/clutch killer of a pull away.
Think Smiffy more than answers the training bit

 

[Left hooker]

It's a merc enough said local plant hire firm to me had one while their scania was in for repair, the merc couldn't do half the stuff the scania could, it got stuck just looking at a hill would say it's a fine truck for motorway rco jobs but nothing else
Had to tow it up a hill empty as wouldn't pull away

 

[V8Druid]

It's a merc enough said local plant hire firm to me had one while their scania was in for repair, the merc couldn't do half the stuff the scania could, it got stuck just looking at a hill would say it's a fine truck for motorway rco jobs but nothing else
Had to tow it up a hill empty as wouldn't pull away

QED there Stu