Pan Mixer

[Stroppymonkey]

My local concrete place has just yanked prices up. £105+vat for C20/25 which is fine, but we often only get a cube, and the empty load charge has just gone from £75+vat upto £165+vat for the 4cube lorry.
We often want smaller loads and have collected in the tipper trailer with a layer of DPM but its not a very good way and a PITA to clean / unload etc.
Toyed with getting a pan mixer (like photo below) to mount on ifor 8x4 tipper trailer so I can easily collect upto 3/4 cube (anymore will be too heavy for trailer + mixer + concrete) but not sure how much power I need to keep it stirring and to unload. I have seen the spec for how much power required to MIX, but I assume a smaller hydraulic pack would still run it but much slower? If it is already mixed then presumably I just need to stir it slowly enough? Would my micro machine (E10Z piped for aux) turn it? Despite having plenty of oil/gas/water pipe knowledge, hydraulics are a mystery to me.
Anyone got some thoughts?
Always working in small places with little access and building oil tank bases needing 0.5 cube normally, so often a dumpy bag delivered is a pain in the ass with left overs, so we always take our kit with us on the day on 3.5 ton flat bed / pickup or trailers. After 20 years of mixing concrete bases (and half my childhood mixing concrete on the farm AND a solid year labouring and mixing on site for a bricky I have VERY little interest in machine mixing. Might have to go back to it a little more again though :-(

 

[doobin]

My local concrete place has just yanked prices up. £105+vat for C20/25 which is fine, but we often only get a cube, and the empty load charge has just gone from £75+vat upto £165+vat for the 4cube lorry.
We often want smaller loads and have collected in the tipper trailer with a layer of DPM but its not a very good way and a PITA to clean / unload etc.
Toyed with getting a pan mixer (like photo below) to mount on ifor 8x4 tipper trailer so I can easily collect upto 3/4 cube (anymore will be too heavy for trailer + mixer + concrete) but not sure how much power I need to keep it stirring and to unload. I have seen the spec for how much power required to MIX, but I assume a smaller hydraulic pack would still run it but much slower? If it is already mixed then presumably I just need to stir it slowly enough? Would my micro machine (E10Z piped for aux) turn it? Despite having plenty of oil/gas/water pipe knowledge, hydraulics are a mystery to me.
Anyone got some thoughts?
Always working in small places with little access and building oil tank bases needing 0.5 cube normally, so often a dumpy bag delivered is a pain in the ass with left overs, so we always take our kit with us on the day on 3.5 ton flat bed / pickup or trailers. After 20 years of mixing concrete bases (and half my childhood mixing concrete on the farm AND a solid year labouring and mixing on site for a bricky I have VERY little interest in machine mixing. Might have to go back to it a little more again though :-(
View attachment 43039

When I looked in to this, a bloke who sounded like he knew what he was talking about said that a power pack simply wouldn’t give you the flow to mix properly

Remember that in a normal mixer, gravity does almost all of the work of mixing. A tub mixer is very different, and you need sufficient rotor speed to throw the mix about.

A wet mix might be ok, but there are surely better and cheaper ways of collecting readymix?

 

[Stroppymonkey]

When I looked in to this, a bloke who sounded like he knew what he was talking about said that a power pack simply wouldn’t give you the flow to mix properly

Remember that in a normal mixer, gravity does almost all of the work of mixing. A tub mixer is very different, and you need sufficient rotor speed to throw the mix about.

A wet mix might be ok, but there are surely better and cheaper ways of collecting readymix?

You're probably right! I need something washable and portable that I can line my 8x4 tipper with that has a controllable hatch / Shute that will be high enough to drop into a mucktruck or power barrow. Needs to hold a cube plus slop room. Needs to be forkliftable so I can take it off back at yard and tip it over to get half cured dregs out.
I can ALWAYS use old concrete back at the yard.

 

[doobin]

You're probably right! I need something washable and portable that I can line my 8x4 tipper with that has a controllable hatch / Shute that will be high enough to drop into a mucktruck or power barrow. Needs to hold a cube plus slop room. Needs to be forkliftable so I can take it off back at yard and tip it over to get half cured dregs out.
I can ALWAYS use old concrete back at the yard.

Might be worth making up a custom steel tub with a chute? You could even add a hydraulic pusher plate of some sort.

Or possibly an old auger feed bucket? They come pretty big, would just need a cradle for it which could also have the forklift slots.

 

[V8Druid]

You're probably right! I need something washable and portable that I can line my 8x4 tipper with that has a controllable hatch / Shute that will be high enough to drop into a mucktruck or power barrow. Needs to hold a cube plus slop room. Needs to be forkliftable so I can take it off back at yard and tip it over to get half cured dregs out.
I can ALWAYS use old concrete back at the yard.

small hook lift skip sat in the trailer with a chute cut/formed into one end? .. height would still be an issue though

 

[TiltyShaun]

How much does a cube of wet concrete weight. Going to be fun lifting a tub out with a one tonne digger!!

 

[Stroppymonkey]

How much does a cube of wet concrete weight. Going to be fun lifting a tub out with a one tonne digger!!

I want to tip it out down a chute into a power barrow or straight onto slab if lucky. Don't want micro on site at the same time as concrete normally.

 

[Smiffy]

There was a company on Facebook the other day advertising a half pipe tipper trailer. Has disadvantages over a normal 3.5t tipper as can't drop the sides but would seal a lot better. At the yard to clean out make a rake/spazzle and rubber squeegee that fits the profile of the tipper.
This would likely give the best carrying capacity.
As for tipping into a muck truck a pair of ramps made out of layered 6x2 timber to reverse the trailer onto. It's how they get tarmac into tracked barrows

 

[Stroppymonkey]

This would be lovely. Sometimes the Americans get good ideas...

 

[T whiting]

I'd say half a dozen mortar tubs would be your best bet. Thats the same pan mixer we have and it's a big job washing it out, it's a jetwash job to get it clean nearly to the point of if it's less than a dumpy bag it's easier to mix it with a minimize.

I mix quite a lot on the floor with the digger it doesn't take long you can soon knock a couple of to up just do it like you used to with a shovel on the farm but let the hydraulics do the work.

 

[Quattromike]

View attachment 43041This would be lovely. Sometimes the Americans get good ideas...

Why don't they do a ground drive option

 

[Stroppymonkey]

Can't find anything in uk.. Guess a cube plus the kit is going to be close to or over 3500kg so not valid for UK/Europe market.

 

[6feetdown]

I'd say half a dozen mortar tubs would be your best bet. Thats the same pan mixer we have and it's a big job washing it out, it's a jetwash job to get it clean nearly to the point of if it's less than a dumpy bag it's easier to mix it with a minimize.

I mix quite a lot on the floor with the digger it doesn't take long you can soon knock a couple of to up just do it like you used to with a shovel on the farm but let the hydraulics do the work.

We bought 1 a couple of months ago. As you said washing is a pain but we've loaded with mini digger then dumped with the Avant. A bulky bit of kit but way better than a small mixer.
Running at about 40 litres a minute

 

[JD450A]

The issue with roading concrete is separation. To be honest you will still get this issue with a pan mixer as they don't exactly lift the concrete and it's the aggregate sinking via gravity and vibration which is the problem.

 

[6feetdown]

The issue with roading concrete is separation. To be honest you will still get this issue with a pan mixer as they don't exactly lift the concrete and it's the aggregate sinking via gravity and vibration which is the problem.

Yeah you need to keep an eye whilst mixing as easy to end up with a big clump.

 

[Brendan]

How much does a cube of wet concrete weight. Going to be fun lifting a tub out with a one tonne digger!!

2.4t give or take 100kg

 

[Stroppymonkey]

The issue with roading concrete is separation. To be honest you will still get this issue with a pan mixer as they don't exactly lift the concrete and it's the aggregate sinking via gravity and vibration which is the problem.

Yes its an issue.. We usually seem to get over it okay, it's usually laid within 30 minutes of being mixed/loaded and if you spread it out over the slab evenly it seems to finish off OK. I'm just trying to find a simple ish low labour option. Taking lads off heating jobs where we are charging out at nearly £50 an hour to drive a shovel instead is something I am keen to reduce.

 

[Brendan]

Yes its an issue.. We usually seem to get over it okay, it's usually laid within 30 minutes of being mixed/loaded and if you spread it out over the slab evenly it seems to finish off OK. I'm just trying to find a simple ish low labour option. Taking lads off heating jobs where we are charging out at nearly £50 an hour to drive a shovel is something I am keen to reduce.

What sort of price are volumetric mixers round your way?
If time is more of a concern will always be quicker having it delivered

 

[JD450A]

Yes its an issue.. We usually seem to get over it okay, it's usually laid within 30 minutes of being mixed/loaded and if you spread it out over the slab evenly it seems to finish off OK. I'm just trying to find a simple ish low labour option. Taking lads off heating jobs where we are charging out at nearly £50 an hour to drive a shovel is something I am keen to reduce.

Have you looked into using the likes of mix 2 match with his little volumetric?

 

[Stroppymonkey]

need to get something like this fabricated up on a pallet that I can drop into my tipper.. I have a 1500 litre conical plastic tank with a steel frame in the top yard that I use for settling dirty oil. It doesn't work too well as it's too thick to see through. I wonder if it might be a good base for a concrete tub liner...