Avant 423

[Paveman]

We are are la paving company and considering buying an Avant 423, does anyone run one.
We are looking at this machine as its small enough for domestic work and easy to tow.
Any opinions please especially lift capacity with forks would need to be able to manage 4 to 5 hundred kilos.
Thanks.

 

[doobin]

We are are la paving company and considering buying an Avant 423, does anyone run one.
We are looking at this machine as its small enough for domestic work and easy to tow.
Any opinions please especially lift capacity with forks would need to be able to manage 4 to 5 hundred kilos.
Thanks.

Are you sure 4-500kgs is enough lift? It would mean splitting down any deliveries, and I'd say most of the efficiency my loader gives me on such jobs is by being able to pick up the pallet and put it exactly where I need it. Or bulk bags of sand, etc.

 

[Paveman]

I agree regarding moving pallets etc, however we need to compromise as our sites are all local council jobs with next to no access.
We have a forklift in our yard so we take only material needed to our jobs however we still need to move up to 500 kg when on site.
The Avant has a tipping capacity of 550 kg however that does not mean it can lift and carry this on the forks I think.
Is anyone using an actual 423 on this type of work.
We also looked at mini skid loaders but decided they cause too much damage and while very compact dont have great lifting capacity.

 

[doobin]

I agree regarding moving pallets etc, however we need to compromise as our sites are all local council jobs with next to no access.
We have a forklift in our yard so we take only material needed to our jobs however we still need to move up to 500 kg when on site.
The Avant has a tipping capacity of 550 kg however that does not mean it can lift and carry this on the forks I think.
Is anyone using an actual 423 on this type of work.
We also looked at mini skid loaders but decided they cause too much damage and while very compact dont have great lifting capacity.

It will be far better for unloading and moving materials than a mini skid. I run both types. The articulation of a mini loader means it's great for sneaking around corners and down passageways.

You could look at a Multione 4 series. 980mm wide, looks like you could get it narrower with different wheels. Rated lifting capacity is 880kg with backweights, and I've found their rated capacities to be pretty accurate. You're just about into bulk bag on a pallet territory then.

Homepage - Multione

Whatever you need, MultiOne can do it: discover our mini loaders, find your nearest dealer and contact us for any request you have.

www.multione.com

When you put the specs next to each other there's really not a lot in it. You will probably find the Multione quite a bit cheaper also.

 

[Smiffy]

I am a supervisor for a firm doing a lot of local authority work. I don't know how similar our work is as we are mostly dealing with surface water issues.
All our work is on tarmac. We wouldn't consider a multi one type machine for several reasons. Firstly to big to turn in our sites, to inefficient either opening barriers or finding a turning space. Especially if trying to replace barrow boys on tarmac work. Next is no oscillating joint or axle. We would constantly be bumping up and down kerbs at an angle so would be unpleasant. And lastly any gang I work with would smash every panel by tea break.
If you want an Arctic steer then at the expense of lift capacity there are several wheel loaders available that oscillate and are built in a way that would be more employee proof (especially tarmaccer). Next option is look at what @doobin can achieve with his mini skidsteer. For cramped sites it's far better as will turn in a single lane with barriers and cones in place. For grass areas they fit on a single tractor matt. You can buy a lot of tracmatts for the cost difference between the skidsteer and the avant. And whilst they won't lift what the avant does they will still carry more than twice what a labourer and barrow will and the second labourers wages will pay for it in less than a year. Thirdly have you got a grab lorry?? We simply set up site so everything can be dropped by grab lorry. For the work a grab lorry is without doubt the most cost effective tool.

 

[6feetdown]

I am a supervisor for a firm doing a lot of local authority work. I don't know how similar our work is as we are mostly dealing with surface water issues.
All our work is on tarmac. We wouldn't consider a multi one type machine for several reasons. Firstly to big to turn in our sites, to inefficient either opening barriers or finding a turning space. Especially if trying to replace barrow boys on tarmac work. Next is no oscillating joint or axle. We would constantly be bumping up and down kerbs at an angle so would be unpleasant. And lastly any gang I work with would smash every panel by tea break.
If you want an Arctic steer then at the expense of lift capacity there are several wheel loaders available that oscillate and are built in a way that would be more employee proof (especially tarmaccer). Next option is look at what @doobin can achieve with his mini skidsteer. For cramped sites it's far better as will turn in a single lane with barriers and cones in place. For grass areas they fit on a single tractor matt. You can buy a lot of tracmatts for the cost difference between the skidsteer and the avant. And whilst they won't lift what the avant does they will still carry more than twice what a labourer and barrow will and the second labourers wages will pay for it in less than a year. Thirdly have you got a grab lorry?? We simply set up site so everything can be dropped by grab lorry. For the work a grab lorry is without doubt the most cost effective tool.

I'm always amazed where I can get the avant and it's the biggest they do. What about 1 of the stand behind loaders like @doobins pretty good lift capacity on some of them too

 

[6feetdown]

Sherpa: The Giant Mini Skidsteer Loader | Compact Loaders UK

SHERPA is the Giant amongst mini skidsteer loaders, lift & shift, add multifunction tools, the Compact Wheel Loader that does it all.

compactloaders.co.uk

 

[doobin]

I'm always amazed where I can get the avant and it's the biggest they do. What about 1 of the stand behind loaders like @doobins pretty good lift capacity on some of them too

They're very good indeed, but as soon as you have stuff palletised and need to lift it on and off trucks or trailers, you can halve the rated lift capacity. Which is only 200-250kg ish with the weight all close in using a bucket anyhow. I use mine by hand loading materials to move, scooping up bulk materials and grabbing and moving things like lumps of timber.

Articulated loaders lift so much more by virtue of the whole back end and engine being the counterwight (hence the non-oscillating centre joint). That's how they can lift such and incredibly large percentage of their own weight.

If he's looking to lift 500kg a mini skid is just not the right thing.

 

[Smiffy]

Sherpa: The Giant Mini Skidsteer Loader | Compact Loaders UK

SHERPA is the Giant amongst mini skidsteer loaders, lift & shift, add multifunction tools, the Compact Wheel Loader that does it all.

compactloaders.co.uk

That's what I mean for the mini skidsteer.

And whilst the loader I have no doubt will get in places it is turning round in a single lane that would be a down fall for us, can't get a bucket full of tarmac out a wagon then tip it for the gang. Also can't unload of a lorry in a set of temp traffic lights. Other than of the rear but then only 2 pallets. Also once you have a pallet in the road you can't get round it. A hiab will unload a whole lorry and leave them in a line in front of it down the single carriageway.
Highway work, which I am pressuring this is, I may be wrong. Has a completely unique set of challenges due to a very long very narrow site. You can just about run a 1.5t conventional machine but anything bigger needs to be zero turn. Tbh it has to be really needed to warrant even using a 2.5t machine as they are so clumsy. Allot of the time any time saving of having a machine on site is counteracted by the machine getting in the way.

 

[TiltyShaun]

That's what I mean for the mini skidsteer.

And whilst the loader I have no doubt will get in places it is turning round in a single lane that would be a down fall for us, can't get a bucket full of tarmac out a wagon then tip it for the gang. Also can't unload of a lorry in a set of temp traffic lights. Other than of the rear but then only 2 pallets. Also once you have a pallet in the road you can't get round it. A hiab will unload a whole lorry and leave them in a line in front of it down the single carriageway.
Highway work, which I am pressuring this is, I may be wrong. Has a completely unique set of challenges due to a very long very narrow site. You can just about run a 1.5t conventional machine but anything bigger needs to be zero turn. Tbh it has to be really needed to warrant even using a 2.5t machine as they are so clumsy. Allot of the time any time saving of having a machine on site is counteracted by the machine getting in the way.

Interesting comments. I also wonder why you see the boys struggling along with a little digger doing trench work. Never considered the logistics!! Let alone the towing issues!!!

 

[Paveman]

Thanks everybody for all your comments and help, the level of information available is amazing.
We have probably decided to try an Avant or similar as it does seem to be the best fit for us and we figure that if it does not work out it will be easy enough to sell on again.
We have picked out the 423 as it seems easy enough to carry behind the transit and while its only 1000kg aprox it seems to have reasonable capacity.
I know most people seem to use the 5 series machine but is anybody using an actual Avant 423 for lifting carrying etc,

 

[doobin]

Thanks everybody for all your comments and help, the level of information available is amazing.
We have probably decided to try an Avant or similar as it does seem to be the best fit for us and we figure that if it does not work out it will be easy enough to sell on again.
We have picked out the 423 as it seems easy enough to carry behind the transit and while its only 1000kg aprox it seems to have reasonable capacity.
I know most people seem to use the 5 series machine but is anybody using an actual Avant 423 for lifting carrying etc,

On paper the Multione 4 series has 300kg more capacity lifting capacity for the same weight machine.And double the tipping weight.

 

[Paveman]

I just looked at those figures, yes it seems that the Multione has a lot better capacity for more or less the same weight and size.
I have drive an Avant on a short demo but never even seen a Multione except on the net.
In terms of reliability etc would both brands be comparable.
I visited the Avant dealers, they have a 1 per cent finance offer which is attractive,however I want to buy the best machine I can , should I consider the M1

 

[6feetdown]

I just looked at those figures, yes it seems that the Multione has a lot better capacity for more or less the same weight and size.
I have drive an Avant on a short demo but never even seen a Multione except on the net.
In terms of reliability etc would both brands be comparable.
I visited the Avant dealers, they have a 1 per cent finance offer which is attractive,however I want to buy the best machine I can , should I consider the M1

I would possibly have gone for a multione the only thing turned me off at the time was lack of dealer support, it seemed they couldn't keep anyone long term i think there was only 1 in the UK.
Hopefully now this is sorted

 

[doobin]

I just looked at those figures, yes it seems that the Multione has a lot better capacity for more or less the same weight and size.
I have drive an Avant on a short demo but never even seen a Multione except on the net.
In terms of reliability etc would both brands be comparable.
I visited the Avant dealers, they have a 1 per cent finance offer which is attractive,however I want to buy the best machine I can , should I consider the M1

Both have their problems. I couldn't recommend one over the other really. Multione gave me much more lift capacity at a better price when I was looking.

 

[CPS]

Get a demo/hire to be sure it will do what you want before you buy. I have 2 multione loaders here, A 5.3 and an older SL28D. I like them both, but i wouldn't say they lift what the paper says they will. The 5.3 will "move" a 1 ton bag around, but its really only good for 750kg.
I had a customers Avant 423 here and we fitted a grab to it.... it certainly seemed to have better capability for its size.

The multione loaders are a great tool, the dealer is not so great in my personal experience.

 

[Paveman]

Get a demo/hire to be sure it will do what you want before you buy. I have 2 multione loaders here, A 5.3 and an older SL28D. I like them both, but i wouldn't say they lift what the paper says they will. The 5.3 will "move" a 1 ton bag around, but its really only good for 750kg.
I had a customers Avant 423 here and we fitted a grab to it.... it certainly seemed to have better capability for its size.

The multione loaders are a great tool, the dealer is not so great in my personal exper

 

[Paveman]

you felt for its size the 423 was capable